The Leftovers

Lithose

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The fact that this thread cant go more than 5 posts without someone mentioning Lost should tell you all you need to know about how people here receive the show. I keep saying it, the Lost Nerd Rage is blinding people from a good show.

I would bet a million dollars that if the same show, same episodes, same everything aired and it was "written by Joss Whedon" and promoted as such the same people who hate it would like it.
I never watched Lost, and thought Prometheus was dumb but an okay movie. Sorry, I still think the show is bad (But I haven't watched all the episodes yet). Seb describes why just fine. Grief porn is also a great description, of both the show, and why it's just horribly boring. Maybe I quit it too early, but grief is a difficult emotion to garner empathy with unless it's contrasted against the hopes and dreams of a character we're already involved with OR it stems from a plot we can connect with. It's not like a set of tits in a porno where I just have a biological reaction to it (Which is the only reason porn is effective.). Grief is one of those things that actually requires understanding of the nuance, understanding of the "fall" from happiness to grief. That's how you develop some empathy (Not sympathy) for the grief people feel in stories, and that's what makes characters interesting.

These characters might BECOME interesting in their own right later, sure, as grief becomes ONE emotion out of many in a fully fleshed out person. But as I grit my teeth through the first 3 episodes, I didn't see that happening. All I saw was a slow plodding of nebulous, bland plot points until the next grief-splosion (Or outrageous/stupid action inspired by said grief); which again, I don't care about, because it's bursting from a character that I don't know enough about to even care why he's sad. The only thing I can do is sympathize with him or her that they are, indeed, sad (Because the actors are decent at conveying it).

What makes this worse is that the plot doesn't really inspire us to empathize with the grief either--because the plot point doesn't offer closure, like the kind you'd find if someone died in a tidal wave or a terrorist incident. When someone disappears people don't just go into grief mode. Usually they try to find out what happened, in fact, denial, anger or the other stages of "loss" are far more appropriate when there is no "closure" yet--the first thing we do is try to deny the worst, while working toward figuring out a solution. So the showsvery firstplot point stimulated an emotion/reaction (Desire/curiosity) in me that ran counter to what every character IN the show is feeling (Absolute grief and acceptance that the people are dead). And while that's fine for the characters IN the show, since it's been two years (And over that time, those feelings would transform into loss/grief as hope is lost), formethe total elapsed time between finding out people DISAPPEARED (NOT killed) and the current story wasoneminute.

So the plot didn't really give me (And I assume others) a vehicle to develop any empathy with these people--we're all still stuck in that "the fuck?" mode, burning to have questionsanswered--in denial (At best) at the powerlessness to answer these questions. We are feeling like we want to work toward a mystery, meanwhile though these jack asses we are watching have already skipped past those initial reactions, and shot all the way into stage 4 full grief mode. It feels alien, it feels difficult to connect with, because the plot slapped us with an emotion completely contrary to the stage the characters are in--we didn't experience the the slow acceptance of not being able to find answers, or the failure of any authority to do so. We are TOLD this happened, and then a bunch of sad as shit people are plopped in front of us..

Like I said though, as the story progresses, the characters might unfurl enough to garner some empathy; if they eventually aren't one dimensional grief vehicles, that is. But the first few episodes just felt especially awful due to the above and that's not just because people are hating on lindolff, it's because the show did a poor job of giving us something to connect with.
 
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Gunnar Durden
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I'm glad you like it, but the show is legitimately boring to a lot of people. I agree the production is pretty good, the soundtrack is good, and some of the acting is good, but none of that is enough to account for how boring the show is. If we're going to pretend that "grief porn" is actually a real genre, I think we can at least agree that it's not a genre that's going to garner much excitement. If you decide to watch this show just be aware that a decent chunk of your time will be spent watching people who never talk and people doing mundane tasks like buying groceries.
That's fair to say. I still think a lot of the boring feedback is based on people expecting a type of show this never intended to be.
 

khalid

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The other problem is the GR are fucking horrible people. The show spends 40% of its time covering characters that in RL would be in the Westboro Baptist Church. No one is going to empathize with people going around telling others to fuck off, stop caring about their family and stop grieving for the people they lost. At the same time, these horrible people also abandoned their own families, causing even more grief.
 

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Gunnar Durden
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I dont think they want us to sympathize with them. Where do you get that idea. They are horrible people, and we are supposed to hate them, while watching the wife struggle between her "faith" and family.

I think Im watching a different show than you guys.
 
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Gunnar Durden
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I dont think they want us to sympathize with them. Where do you get that idea. They are horrible people, and we are supposed to hate them, while watching the wife struggle between her "faith" and family.

I think Im watching a different show than you guys.
 

khalid

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Well, if they aren't trying to get us to sympathize with us, then why spend so much of the show on totally unlikable people? I mean, the "horrific" stoning scene and the grief of the people afterwards, seemed designed to do that. Now mind you, I didn't feel a single bit of sadness and was rolling my eyes at the people "against grief" feeling horrible.

Now again, maybe that is all what they are trying to do. The writers are doing grief porn and I'm supposed to hate the GRs, even though they are such a big part of the show. Well, good job, but it isn't fun to watch when they are onscreen.
 
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Szeth

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So I was totally convinced that the bald guy dipping and Kevin were the same guy. Then the leader of the GR made a comment to dispel that. Then as she was dying I had a sick thought that he was actually Kevin, the bald dip guy, AND her.

But I watched it at 6:00am and my brain was not quite functioning yet.
 

Antagonist_sl

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I strongly suspect this show isn't going anywhere particularly interesting. I like the premise, acting, and production in general. But I think it is gonna be a slow-roll descent into chaos that ultimately reveals nothing about the missing people.

I just don't think the characters are interesting enough without the setting. Hope I'm wrong, we'll see I guess...
 
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Slaythe

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I strongly suspect this show isn't going anywhere particularly interesting. I like the premise, acting, and production in general. But I think it is gonna be a slow-roll descent into chaos that ultimately reveals nothing about the missing people.

I just don't think the characters are interesting enough without the setting. Hope I'm wrong, we'll see I guess...
I'm sort of curious where they go after the first season (is there going to be more than one season?) because at that point they'll have to make up their own material, which theoretically could be way better than what they're basing off now.
 

Slaythe

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So I was totally convinced that the bald guy dipping and Kevin were the same guy. Then the leader of the GR made a comment to dispel that. Then as she was dying I had a sick thought that he was actually Kevin, the bald dip guy, AND her.

But I watched it at 6:00am and my brain was not quite functioning yet.
Bald guy stops over with some beer a couple episodes back and the daughter interacts with him. Up until that point your questions were definitely valid. Can't wait until we see some more people doing God's work this time with cigars. Or maybe some health conscious cult nuts that go with e-cigs instead.
 

Mist

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Apparently there are people who like this show.

Who knew?
 
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Slaythe

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I get to hear a dude in my social group praise this show on a weekly basis. He's always been the type of guy to latch on to things other people don't like though. Really enjoys being the martyr. It's pretty annoying.
 
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woot!

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I would bet a million dollars that if the same show, same episodes, same everything aired and it was "written by Joss Whedon" and promoted as such the same people who hate it would like it.

People hated it before it started because of Lindelof and never gave it a shot. They decided before it started it was shit and then every episode they looked for things to shit on.
I started watching the show last weekend, not knowing anything about either who wrote it, or what it was about (a friend told me I might find it interesting so I just checked it out).
One of the first things I thought was "this is built just like lost". It is blatantly obvious.
episodes focused on one character : check
flashbacks : check
shitstorm of unexplained nonsense : check
I mean, what's with the GR and cigarettes ? the magical hugs black dude getting his "power" from fucking asian chicks ? yeaaaaah right ... at some point, I started to wonder if the scenario had been written using a method similar to the one described in the Cartoon Wars episode of South Park (manatees picking up "idea balls" from a large pile of them, each of which has a different noun, a verb or a pop culture reference written on it, and deliver them, five at a time, to a machine that then forms a Family Guy cutaway gag based on those ideas)

I kept watching so far in hope of getting some explainations, but from what I gathered from reading the last pages of this thread, it looks like tough luck ?
That being said, I kind of liked ep 8, it was ... a bit different ?
 

khorum

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Just go ahead and google the book's wiki and get spoiled if you're looking for a grand revelation because there is none. The show is a little more manipulative about SUGGESTING that there's some kind of revelation coming (with its presentation of Wayne's cult and crazy granpa Garvey's visions) but after this episode they pretty much swung the other way and exposed the book's few definitive themes: that messianic cults and voices heard by crazy people are essentially the same thing.

I'm irritated by the upstate new york setting more than anything else, really. The whiny, overgrown spoiled brats pitying themselves throughout the show are actually a feature of that setting. Pretty sure shifting the focus to Detroit or Tijuana or Mogadishu in the same world would be a billion times more interesting.
 

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Gunnar Durden
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Well they are doing a season 2 so they will be doing much more than the book, so I wouldn't bet on that being a good spoiler.

I thought this weeks episode was fan fucking tastic.
 
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Gunnar Durden
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Holy fuck. That finale was exquisite. My wife and I were speechless at parts.

Read the thread and you'll find hate, watch 4 episodes and you'll be hooked. Watch all 10 and you will see an amazing show. Wow. Al season they blew me away with the story and production and that finale was one of the most powerful I've ever seen.

I implore you, watch this season and post. You'll be blown away.
 
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Gunnar Durden
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Also I remembered why I once loved Metallica during that instrumental of nothing else matters