The Matrix reboot/remake

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Ambiturner

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Boy I wish they had gone with their earlier script rather than all of the philosophic word salad and generic religious symbolism.

The first one was great because it loosely followed the whole Jesus thing that you could recognize in retrospect, but the 2nd and 3rd were so in your face and blatantly over the top that it was major distraction and cringeworthy.

I definitely rolled my eyes when the Hindu father was talking about karma for no fucking reason.
 
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Arbitrary

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I'm sure they thought that dialogue was really fucking clever.

Another thing that I really didn't like in the later films were the props and art design. In the first film there's this weird mix of the old and the new both in fashion and in the tech devices that get used. You've got this weird rotary phone hook up thing, the zapper that removes the tracking device, the tracking device itself, etc. There's just a lot of weird little things. I wanted a bit more of that.
 
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Muurloen

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GDI people.

There was no real world. It was another layer of the matrix.

The Architect stated that it required a lesser mind (the oracle) for the machines to solve the problem of why humans were rejecting his harmony of mathematical precision. The "real world" was choice, was a false choice and was designed for 1% of humans that rejected the reality that the matrix gave them. That is why Neo was able to destroy the machines outside of the matrix, as his code worked in both realities.

It is all control by the machines over the humans.
 
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Arbitrary

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That was what they set up in the 2nd film and then went on to not pay off in the 3rd.
 
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The Edge

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GDI people.

There was no real world. It was another layer of the matrix.

The Architect stated that it required a lesser mind (the oracle) for the machines to solve the problem of why humans were rejecting his harmony of mathematical precision. The "real world" was choice, was a false choice and was designed for 1% of humans that rejected the reality that the matrix gave them. That is why Neo was able to destroy the machines outside of the matrix, as his code worked in both realities.

It is all control by the machines over the humans.

Nope. The power of the one extends from the machine world. Simple as that.

2&3 were filmed at the same time, just like LoTR.

The only thing that made them alter anything in the story was the fact that the original oracle died while filming, so they had to explain that.
 

Arbitrary

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Yep, there was definitely a line in the film about the power of The One extending beyond the Matrix. Consider that plot point explained.

Such writing. Much wow.
 

Abefroman

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The mother fuckers don't even know if they want to be brothers or sisters. Every theory is right and wrong at the same time. Wachowski's cat.
 
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Chukzombi

Millie's Staff Member
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Matrix Resolutions

Debunked: Matrix Within Matrix
The Wachowskis make no effort to hide the Matrix-Within-Matrix (MWM) question. It begins in the first movie, when Morpheus tells Neo that all of our senses can be reduced to nothing more than electrical impulses our brain receives. At that point, we are forced to ponder our own existence and whether it can also be reduced to the same thing. The question is continued in the Animatrix short film, Matriculated, when we even get a direct philosophical discussion about this very MWM idea between the scientist and the main female character. As we're set up to wonder about this theory all throughout the movies, we think we have arrived at the answer when we see Neo destroy sentinels with his mind.

But as we find out from the Oracle in the third movie, Neo's gifts extend "beyond this world" (meaning outside of virtual reality, in the real world), and this power is derived from his ability to connect to the Source (see Neo's Powers: Stop Sentinels). I think the Wachowskis simply wanted people to leave the movies wondering, "What if my life were being lived in a Matrix - how would I know?" A movie premise such as the Matrix begs us to ask this question of ourselves, but such begging doesn't mean that it necessarily has to be the truth behind the movie itself.

Clue #1: Neo's Real World Powers Only Affect Machines
First, Neo is only able to bend rules that are a direct result of his interaction with machines in the real world. His "blind vision" allows him to only see machines, and his ability to destroy physical things in the real world applies only to sentinels and sentinel bombs. Never do we see Neo bend spoons, do his "Superman thing" or resurrect Trinity from death in the real world. If the real world were just another layer of virtual reality on top of the Matrix, Neo would likely be able to do a lot more than just affect and interact with machines.

This is by far the strongest clue. Consider how desperate of an argument one would have to make in order to justify why Neo chooses only to bend rules that have to do with machines, but doesn't bother to discover any other bendable rule in his new reality, even when the life of his loved one is at stake. No matter what the justification is, it's always a stretch.

Clue #2: Audience Deception and Asides are Beneath the Wachowskis
In order to believe the Matrix is inside of another Matrix, we have to believe the following asides and points of audience deception occur in the movies:



  • The entire conversation between the Architect and the Oracle would have to be an aside conversation for the purpose of fooling the audience. If these machines were part of a multi-layered Matrix, they wouldn't feel the need to have conversations about change being a "dangerous game" with each other when nobody else is listening. Furthermore, the Oracle wouldn't care if those rejecting the Matrix would be freed or not, because apparently there is no such freedom.

  • When Smith cuts his own hand in the real world, under the MWM theory we are forced to believe that he is doing it in order to fool the audience into thinking it is the real world when it's really not (rather than thinking he's cutting his hand out of his own sincere curiosity about his new fragile sack of meat he finds himself in).

  • If you've watched the movie extras (or if you're observant enough to catch such subtleties), you know that whenever you see a scene inside the Matrix, everything is given a slightly green tint, giving us a feeling of being trapped in a computer world (because of the green we see on an old monochrome computer screen, such as Mr. Anderson's screen at his apartment). This was done very deliberately by the Wachowskis. If we are to believe the "Matrix inside a Matrix" theory, then we would have to assume that the Wachowskis, again, are playing deceptive games with the audience, using green tints to fool the audience into thinking the Matrix has only one level.

  • The most important part of The Animatrix is "The Second Renaissance" (parts I and II). Together, they make up a single animated documentary of how the Matrix came to be. If it is a Matrix inside of a Matrix, that means the Wachowskis' primary purpose in making the animated documentary was to deceive the audience rather than to inform us.
The other option is to believe that machines such as the Oracle, Architect, Merovingian, Agents/Sentinels, etc. are also enslaved as programs running in various levels of the Matrix. In this case, nothing that happens in any of the movies makes any difference. Smith was a lie, the Architect is a moron, and the salvation Neo provided was just a big farce. Under this assumption, why even bother watching the movies?

Clue #3: Machines Allow Humans to Know Their Enemy
If the Matrix were within another Matrix, why would the machines let the humans know their true enemy in the first place? Why wouldn't the second Matrix level just be another pleasant reality void of scorched skies and sentinels? A much more effective strategy than letting humans think they're fighting machines is to let humans wonder what in the world they're fighting at all, if anything. Humans would even be forced to consider the possibility that God is responsible for creating a mysterious world that has various levels of reality that simply cannot be escaped and are not meant to be escaped. Just as we cannot fix something if we do not know it's broken, we also cannot fight an enemy we've never seen, heard, or felt.
 
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LulzSect

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IMG_0945.GIF
 

Chukzombi

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That article basically hinged their entire argument on matrix 3. Matrix 3 is a dumpster fire. So if you only liked 1 and 2, then the matrix in a matrix theory is still valid. Essentially matrix 3 is phantom menace with midichlorians
 

TBT-TheBigToe

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Matrix reboot in a Hollywood culture loaded with SJW agenda's and no sense of self awareness...

WcIDnim.gif


I am sure someone else already posted this. Especially since Switch, the character in the Gif, was supposed to be a different gender depending on which world they were in, actually might have been cool at the time. Now it is just cuckalicous pandering and uninspired.
 

The Edge

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That article basically hinged their entire argument on matrix 3. Matrix 3 is a dumpster fire. So if you only liked 1 and 2, then the matrix in a matrix theory is still valid. Essentially matrix 3 is phantom menace with midichlorians

2 & 3 are one movie split into two, so it's funny when people don't like 3. I understand the complaints about the ending though.
 

Kreugen

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I was very confused when the machines big attack consisted of sentinels crashing into things.
 

Feanor

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Said as much already.
Neo has 'power' in the real world that extends only to the machines. Neo is part machine and Smith part human.

As for the trainman, the station is a port for programs traveling to and from the source and the matrix. The trainman works as a ferryman figure from myth, ferrying exiled programs between one world and the next. The rules in his station are independent 'cause he controls the gateway. It would be like Neo using his windows-matrix mojo in unix. Down there he is not the one. Does not make the plot any less underwhelming against my original anticipation.
 
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Kreugen

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Picture the showdown as Neo using his powers to rip apart the Matrix and kill thousands of Smiths in Dr Strange mirror world fashion until the Matrix itself starts falling apart and lobotomizing everyone connected to it. At least that way being forced to sacrifice himself to finish off Smith makes sense immediately instead of walking out of the theater in a "wtf was that shit?" daze.
 

Feanor

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Their biggest error was emphasizing Neo & Smith and the heavy-handed duality crap. I remember feeling let down when Smith first appeared in Reloaded but rolled with it, as if they resurrected him because they ran out of ideas.
 

Arbitrary

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Said as much as already.

As for the trainman, the station is a port for programs traveling to and from the source and the matrix. The trainman works as a ferryman figure from myth, ferrying exiled programs between one world and the next. The rules in his station are independent 'cause he controls the gateway. It would be like Neo using his windows-matrix mojo in unix. Down there he is not the one. Does not make the plot any less underwhelming against my original anticipation.

Yes sure, if you tried to kick Charon off his boat or ran afoul of the Furies you were fucked. The Furies were powerful enough to punish gods and Charon was supreme in his domain even if his domain was a boat.

But that's all fantasy stuff. I want science fiction, damn it. Explain the SCIENCE.