Vanessa's Tranny AMA Blog Thread

BoozeCube · Apr 16, 2019

TrollfaceDeux · Apr 16, 2019

Vanessa said:
True trans kid suffering from GD as diagnosed by either a trained psychologist, doctor, or endocrinologist; a true tranny that will NOT "outgrow" GD just by going through puberty and in fact will have even more discomfort and distress by going through puberty.

I admit that accurately diagnosing them is something I'm not quite sure of the process either because, as is obvious, I'm not a doctor/endocrinologist myself (duh) so I can't tell specifically tell you their methods. I'd love to know though, sure... I love fact based info. I'm sure enough that in one paper they discussed that for adolescent kids with gender issues, they have a team of specialist assigned for them but I'd really have to dig that quote up again as I don't have it on me RIGHT this second, but it's in there somewhere.

If it seems my definitions are malleable, that's not how I'm intending them to be. At all. Ask me for a specific definition and will specifically, accurately, and scientifically define them for you.

Feels feels feels, no facts.

The way in interpret it, this sounds more like mental issue than gender issue.

Vanessa · Apr 16, 2019

pysek said:
Not to intrude, and for the sake of argument granting everything you say, my question is this: Given that a 100% accuracy rating, in terms of treatments going to the right person, is statistically impossible, meaning that some GD kids WILL go through puberty and some non GD kids WILL be most certainly given permanently life-altering hormones, do you genuinely think it's worth those kids being permanently fucked so someone else's mental illness ( which I believe you've granted your condition is) can be assuaged? I do not mean disrespect, I do not doubt your sincerity, but would that trade-off really be worth it to you?

First you need to post the data indicating children are being harmed. I mean, honestly, the onus is on us ALL to prove that this is happening.

Secondly, if we can prove that this is happening, what is that percentage? 1%? Less? I'm honestly saying I don't know because I have seen 0 scientific evidence or papers indicating a child that was put on puberty blockers and later HRT was a tragic case of misdiagnosis.

Either way, let's just say it's 5% (yes I think that's a huge number, but we'll round UP to help YOUR argument).

Someone said (Booze I think) that 80% > 20%. Would you guys agree? Y'all agree because that is exactly y'alls stance you're taking. Fuck the 20% of trans kids who will suffer by not getting the puberty blockers that science has shown helps them mentally and physically... we care more about the 80%. THAT is an ethics judgment call RIGHT THERE.

Secondly, what is higher now using your same stance and logic of 80% > 20%. Is 20% > 5% ? Yup.

You see where I'm going with this. This is going to be a shitty situation no matter HOW you slice it. Deny that fact is sheer ignorance.

I'd never wish any child harmed. I'm a Christian Conservative underneath this tranny shit. I don't want to see any child suffer, trans or not. Period. End of story. Eliminating the option of the 20% not getting help is also child abuse. Don't think otherwise.

Lightning Lord Rule said:
Good! Now that that's out of the way I'm getting into this debate, because potentially harming children triggers me badly.

How would you respond to this post I made in the GG thread the last time this issue came up?

The thing about making a scientific argument is that AngryGerbil is correct, you are inherently appealing to authority. Someone would be as logically sound by saying that the devil compels you to put kids on puberty blockers, since in both cases you are appealing to an outside authority that is perceived to be higher than yourself, whether it be the devil or science.

Also, ethics is not about feelings it is about philosophy, something science is not well equipped to handle. Put another way, science can possibly tell you what to do or what not to do, but it cannot tell you why or why not.
With this inherent limitation in mind, why would scientific possibility be the end-all be-all argument for putting children who's futures are anything but certain through a procedure that has the potential to permanently harm them if you imperfectly divine the outcome of at least 5 years in the future?

My response to Psyek I think should answer your post too LLR, perhaps with this exception: Unless there are some clear cut cases of children who have overwhelmingly clear-cut cases of GD (like Jazz Jennings), how will ever know that puberty blockers ARE effective? See the catch 22 of this?

Vanessa said:
Fact: In cases of true trans-kids, puberty blockers are both beneficial and effective.

O <---click me
Reports of the outcomes of puberty suppression treatment in adolescents have shown reasonable safety and good outcomes regarding patient satisfaction and psychosocial functioning

O <---click me
In the Dutch authors’ words, the treatment, including puberty suppression, cross-sex hormones, and then in adulthood gender affirmation surgery, “leads to improved psychological functioning of transgender adolescents. While enabling them to make important age-appropriate developmental transitions, it contributes to a satisfactory objective and subjective well-being in young adulthood”.33 The authors propose that not only early medical intervention, but also a comprehensive multidisciplinary approach contributes to the youth’s gender health.

O <---click me
However, psychological therapy and support are highly recommended; while such services are now far more widely available, they are still insufficient to provide for complete wellbeing of these patients. Inadequate management of children with persistent gender dysphoria can lead to isolation, feeling of self-hatred, and suicidal ideas and attempts. Also, “passing through the wrong puberty” can have serious consequences for these individuals. Viable treatment options vary from fully reversible treatment, such as puberty-suppressing gonadotropin-releasing hormone analogues (GnRH) to partly reversible treatment, gonadal steroid treatment, as well as irreversible treatment, such as surgical removal of genitalia and reconstruction of new ones according to the desired gender.

De Vries et al. were the first to introduce the concept and research on the use of puberty blockers for treatment of transgender youth. The main idea behind the suppression of endogenous puberty was to decrease distress by preventing the development of “noncongruent” secondary sexual characteristics. This would give young individuals more time to get accustomed to their situation and to better explore their gender. In the examined group, all of 70 eligible candidates showed improved mental health and general functioning.

I wouldn't condone puberty blockers on kids if the data showed that it didn't work and there were lots of problems in this realm. I'm saying, without ANY bias, that the research and data shown above indicate that it's a good thing for trans kids. This isn't my opinion, this isn't my -feels- Gerbil, this is what the data says. This is what I am basing my opinions on because, you tell me... what else do we have to base facts on if NOT the research and data???

Foler · Apr 16, 2019

Vanessa is like a tranny flat earther. Prove me wrong.

Lanx · Apr 16, 2019

BoozeCube said:

wow he looks like shit

TDS really fucks w/ your health, his skin looks ragged from anxiety and worry and aged like 10 years, all those fold's of skin and pre-wrinkles, looks like he's gained 20lbs too, and that hair, he's already got the crusty old man hair.

Vanessa · Apr 16, 2019

Anyway, I'm tired and it's past my bedtime. I'm sure many of you have more on your mind and I'm perfectly happy to continue this... post away, I'll read them tomorrow

Vanessa · Apr 16, 2019

But one last post before I sign off:

Foler said:
Vanessa is like a tranny flat earther. Prove me wrong.

Feels feels feels, No facts.

Foler · Apr 16, 2019

Vanessa said:
But one last post before I sign off:

Feels feels feels, No facts.

Numerous facts have been provided. You've yet to cite any reputable source for any of your paragraphs of claims. So v delusional.

AngryGerbil · Apr 16, 2019

Biology is the product of Creation.

God is perfect.

I was Created to be a man in a woman's body.

Only Science can prove me right.

pysek · Apr 16, 2019

Vanessa said:
First you need to post the data indicating children are being harmed. I mean, honestly, the onus is on us ALL to prove that this is happening.

Secondly, if we can prove that this is happening, what is that percentage? 1%? Less? I'm honestly saying I don't know because I have seen 0 scientific evidence or papers indicating a child that was put on puberty blockers and later HRT was a tragic case of misdiagnosis.

Either way, let's just say it's 5% (yes I think that's a huge number, but we'll round UP to help YOUR argument).

Someone said (Booze I think) that 80% > 20%. Would you guys agree? Y'all agree because that is exactly y'alls stance you're taking. Fuck the 20% of trans kids who will suffer by not getting the puberty blockers that science has shown helps them mentally and physically... we care more about the 80%. THAT is an ethics judgment call RIGHT THERE.

Secondly, what is higher now using your same stance and logic of 80% > 20%. Is 20% > 5% ? Yup.

You see where I'm going with this. This is going to be a shitty situation no matter HOW you slice it. Deny that fact is sheer ignorance.

I'd never wish any child harmed. I'm a Christian Conservative underneath this tranny shit. I don't want to see any child suffer, trans or not. Period. End of story. Eliminating the option of the 20% not getting help is also child abuse. Don't think otherwise.

I appreciate your response. First, I should have said that I meant to offer a hypothetical. An ethical conundrum, if you will. You mentioned that you wanted the right treatment for the right person. I stated that 100% accuracy in diagnosis and treatment was a statistical impossibility, meaning that some kids would be misdiagnosed. Surely you wouldn't claim that in the future, EVERY single case of GD would be properly diagnosed and treated? So my point was to discern your comfort level with innocent children being misdiagnosed and permanently disfigured in order to placate and support the smaller percentage that might find some comfort in their mentally distressed state through these treatments. Apologies for being unclear. And I am trying to engage with you without being inflammatory, as I do believe you are coming from a place of sincerity and I appreciate your willingness to engage, one Christian conservative to another. And yes, I agree it's a shitty situation, but I vehemently disagree with my interpretation of your conclusions, which seems to be willing to accept some innocent children being potentially ruined. Rather Countess Bathory of you, no?

Foler · Apr 16, 2019

Honestly, I don't think we should let trannies live within a certain distance of schools, parks and playgrounds. If they want to be so special they should have to register. It's not safe for others. There's been numerous incidents of sexual assault and even pedophilia by individuals whom label themselves transgender.

MusicForFish · Apr 17, 2019

A souls a soul.
The container doesnt matter.
Less ego and more soul.

Gamma Rays · Apr 17, 2019

Jeez Vanessa,

Why bother with all this? They're not going to listen, or come to your side. I can't see the need for you bringing all this grief on yourself.

Feanor · Apr 17, 2019

Vanessa said:
View attachment 203655

Let's start with this one basic fact: I'm the only one providing links, citations and references about all of this. Go me.

_________________

Fact: Gender Dysphoria is a real, mental illness (or condition / problem etc.)

O <---click me
Transsexualism (ICD-10),[1] or gender identity disorder (DSM-IV),[2] is a condition in which a person's gender identity - the sense of being a man or a woman - contradicts his or her bodily sex characteristics. The individual experiences gender dysphoria and desires to live and be accepted as a member of the opposite sex.

O <---click me
Gender dysphoria is a discomfiting mental state associated with a disparity between one's internal sense of being either male or female and one's external anatomical sexual characteristics. Because most persons have never experienced such a disparity, perhaps one could empathize by imagining what it would be like for a man to wake up one morning to discover that his penis was gone. Further, imagine that it had been replaced by a vagina, with enlarged breasts on the chest. Surely, the man would feel extremely uncomfortable; manifesting a strong desire to change his body; a desire that is far more intense than a simple cosmetic desire. One could similarly imagine the inverse scenario for a woman. Such intense discomfort, accompanied by a desire for change, is the hallmark of gender dysphoria.

O <---click me
The fifth edition of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5)1 defines gender dysphoria (GD) as a condition in which a person has marked incongruence between the expressed or experienced gender and the biological sex at birth. This causes clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational or other important areas of functioning. Individuals with GD experience a strong desire to be treated as the other gender (or some alternative gender different from their assigned gender) and/or to be rid of their sex characteristics, and/or the strong conviction of having feelings and reactions typical of the other gender (or some alternative gender).

O <---click me
Gender dysphoria (GD) represents a condition where a person's gender assigned at birth and the gender with which they identify themselves are incongruent. Hence, these individuals can be very uncomfortable with their biological sex, primary and secondary sex characteristics, and social gender roles and they experience various levels of distress.

O <---click me
This paper is heavily focused on trans voice, but still states:
"Gender dysphoria (also known as “transsexualism”) is characterized as a discrepancy between anatomical sex and gender identity. Research points towards neurobiological influences."

_________________

Fact: Social transition is the "cure" for GD and is the best treatment for GD (thus far).

O <---click me
One hundred ninety-one had been men with female surgical reassignment. One hundred thirty-three had been women with male surgical reassignment. In most cases, such surgery had diminished the distress of gender dysphoria.

O <---click me
Even though surgery and hormonal therapy alleviates gender dysphoria, it is apparently not sufficient to remedy the high rates of morbidity and mortality found among transsexual persons.

O <---click me
This search found a robust international consensus in the peer-reviewed literature that gender transition, including medical treatments such as hormone therapy and surgeries, improves the overall well-being of transgender individuals.

O <---click me
Although many studies have reported psychiatric and psychological improvement after hormonal and/or surgical treatment,[7], [12], [13], [14], [15], [16] other have reported on regrets,[17] psychiatric morbidity, and suicide attempts after SRS.[9], [18] A recent systematic review and meta-analysis concluded that approximately 80% reported subjective improvement in terms of gender dysphoria, quality of life, and psychological symptoms, but also that there are studies reporting high psychiatric morbidity and suicide rates after sex reassignment.

_________________

Fact: Children exhibiting gender "issues" pre-puberty will, 80% of the time, resolve these issues via puberty.

O <---click me
In contrast to the first two models, no assumption is made that every child exhibiting a gender nonconforming presentation is in need of mental health treatment.

O <---click me
Children represent a small number of individuals with gender dysphoria and in only 10-20% of the children, gender dysphoria will continue to manifest in adolescence

O <---click me
Many individuals continue renegotiating their gender throughout childhood or adulthood, with no observable detriment to their mental health

O <---click me
Evidence from the 10 available prospective follow-up studies from childhood to adolescence (reviewed in the study by Ristori and Steensma28) indicates that for ~80% of children who meet the criteria for GDC, the GD recedes with puberty.

_________________

Fact: In cases of true trans-kids, puberty blockers are both beneficial and effective.

O <---click me
Reports of the outcomes of puberty suppression treatment in adolescents have shown reasonable safety and good outcomes regarding patient satisfaction and psychosocial functioning

O <---click me
In the Dutch authors’ words, the treatment, including puberty suppression, cross-sex hormones, and then in adulthood gender affirmation surgery, “leads to improved psychological functioning of transgender adolescents. While enabling them to make important age-appropriate developmental transitions, it contributes to a satisfactory objective and subjective well-being in young adulthood”.33 The authors propose that not only early medical intervention, but also a comprehensive multidisciplinary approach contributes to the youth’s gender health.

O <---click me
However, psychological therapy and support are highly recommended; while such services are now far more widely available, they are still insufficient to provide for complete wellbeing of these patients. Inadequate management of children with persistent gender dysphoria can lead to isolation, feeling of self-hatred, and suicidal ideas and attempts. Also, “passing through the wrong puberty” can have serious consequences for these individuals. Viable treatment options vary from fully reversible treatment, such as puberty-suppressing gonadotropin-releasing hormone analogues (GnRH) to partly reversible treatment, gonadal steroid treatment, as well as irreversible treatment, such as surgical removal of genitalia and reconstruction of new ones according to the desired gender.

De Vries et al. were the first to introduce the concept and research on the use of puberty blockers for treatment of transgender youth. The main idea behind the suppression of endogenous puberty was to decrease distress by preventing the development of “noncongruent” secondary sexual characteristics. This would give young individuals more time to get accustomed to their situation and to better explore their gender. In the examined group, all of 70 eligible candidates showed improved mental health and general functioning.

_________________

In light of all this, I'm betting some of you will still perform mental gymnastics in order to argue with me about this, that or whatever. Pretty fucking ironic that the forum tranny is the only one providing data, papers, and facts on the matter and the bulk of YOU all are the ones acting like a posse of frothing SJW leftists.

I have NO agenda to push, I have always stated time and time again that ALL I WANT are science, data, research, and testing done to separate fact from fiction, reality from feels. You all are MORE than welcome (and I'm sure some of you will! Hi Mario / Zyyz / wormie) to sling shit, deny the mountain of evidence slapping you in the face that everything I have said is true but I hope the moderate and rational among you realize that willful ignorance on the subject is not cool. Not cool at all.

What I, personally, have gleaned a better understanding of is what some of you have brought up already and that is the fact that 4 out of 5 (on average) kids exhibiting gender incongruence (in some form or another) will "get over it" during puberty. This was something that I myself was ignorant on before now. This isn't something to sweep under the rug. False flags (for lack of better words) are tantamount to a tragedy that I and certainly none of you want to see happen. Yet there's also the study that states that ALL 70 youth undergoing puberty blockers had a better life due to them. What that tells me is that the teams of psychologists and doctors working with the kids and parents are doing their due diligence to separate the true trannies from the cases where "Joey likes dolls, but he's not actually trans, just a gay-boi" etc.

So yes, on the one hand my heart and mind want to say that 80% is too high a number to ignore and medical intervention for trannies needs to wait until 18... bar none. Yet there's still that nagging truth that is documented that true trannies that go through puberty will undergo mental health problems themselves, so I can't ALSO say "Think of the kids, but the trans kids? Eh fuck them tho". If anyone is rational on the matter, the best course of action would be (as I've said before in this thread) to continue to have very strict and regimented medical and psychological professionals dedicated to case by case families to absolutely, 100% ensure that the right patients are getting the right treatments so that literally everyone comes out happy. Evidence is showing this seems to be the case, and that's wonderful news. Have evidence to the contrary? Post it.

No one is denying it's a very very fucking tricky situation. It sucks... it's something I honestly simply wish didn't exist in the world.. this evil, mental illness of a thing called GD. But it does and no amount of whining, bitching, shitposting and being bigoted assfaces about it is going to just make it "go away" or flush away the facts on the matter about it.

To quote one of my favorite people of all time, Ben Shapiro: Facts don't care about your feelings.

-------- repost. We can start here *yet again* for anyone that wants to step up and refute these facts as facts.

All of this data relates to the post I made here.

Feanor said:
Gender dysphoria is a muddy topic to be sure. Nothing wrong with bringing it up, although I disagree with Vanessa trying to steer shit back to her vanity mirror thread. Not an insult, just an observation.

A few people mentioned examples of distress. A great one is breast augmentation or reduction. Let's imagine a teenager that hates her body. She looks at other girls and wishes she had breasts like them. The anxiety is so severe she obsesses all day, utterly hating herself and wanting to die. She asks her old folks for surgery. A good parent would take every measure to make her understand that she might regret her decision one day. That she needs to wait until she is of age to make that choice for herself. You hope she learns to accept herself in time but if she still thinks it's impossible then you will support her 100%. In other words adolescent cosmetic surgery is comparable to gender dysphoria in similar cases.

There's a god playing aspect to hormone blockers. I don't like going against nature and err on the side of self-acceptance. It is notably curious that Vanessa believes in God yet is perfectly fine with biological tinkering. Just an observation again, no disrespect as I'm sure you have dealt with that cognitive dissonance. Puberty inhibitors might benefit acute distress but it isn't unreasonable to wait till kids are 18 seriously WTF IS HAPPENING? WHY IS THIS EVEN A CONVERSATION

Would you permit adolescent cosmetic surgery, ears, breasts, nose, whatever, in cases of acute distress? Federal government should stay out of it and it is an issue for parents to decide. That said, I would err on the side of self-acceptance as stated and think it is far less irresponsible to wait till a person is of age to make their own choices, which they are perfectly entitled to. The benefits of hormone blockers at an early age do not outweigh the necessity of personal agency and adulthood in making your own choices. Parents, teachers, doctors, whoever, can guide you but should never get to decide who you are. That one is up to you.

Vanessa · Apr 17, 2019

The best part of waking up, is coffee and FoH in my cup!

Foler said:
Even poppa Trump agrees

View attachment 203676

LoL, the posts were dropping quicker than zippers at a Gay-pride parade after party last night so I somehow missed this post. You actually made a funny post Foler, well done! But of course, you follow that gem with:

Foler said:
Numerous facts have been provided. You've yet to cite any reputable source for any of your paragraphs of claims. So v delusional.

...and sink right back down to the depths of utter retardation in which you dwell daily. This post is so ass-backwards you've gone into sheer Poe's Law territory and you're right square back into the realm of not being able to tell if you're just trolling here or legitimately even more retarded than previously thought. Now go back into your playpen... adults are conversing here.

pysek said:
I appreciate your response. First, I should have said that I meant to offer a hypothetical. An ethical conundrum, if you will. You mentioned that you wanted the right treatment for the right person. I stated that 100% accuracy in diagnosis and treatment was a statistical impossibility, meaning that some kids would be misdiagnosed. Surely you wouldn't claim that in the future, EVERY single case of GD would be properly diagnosed and treated? So my point was to discern your comfort level with innocent children being misdiagnosed and permanently disfigured in order to placate and support the smaller percentage that might find some comfort in their mentally distressed state through these treatments. Apologies for being unclear. And I am trying to engage with you without being inflammatory, as I do believe you are coming from a place of sincerity and I appreciate your willingness to engage, one Christian conservative to another. And yes, I agree it's a shitty situation, but I vehemently disagree with my interpretation of your conclusions, which seems to be willing to accept some innocent children being potentially ruined. Rather Countess Bathory of you, no?

With more data and research and science (think: brain-scans), we can keep learning and getting more acute diagnosis for genuine GD sufferers vs. non GD sufferers.

One thing I think that I haven't touched on, that should be somewhat common sense but perhaps not as common as I may assume so it's worth stating... GD is like any other mental illness wherein you will find differing levels of severity in individuals. Someone could be suicidal depressed for days on end, and others could simply cry at night from time to time. Some people will have schizophrenia where it is manageable enough on lithium (or whatever they take) and function normally in society and some will probably be like our boy Tad10 and need constant care because they're extremely detached from reality.

There are clear cut kids out there where it will be patently obvious that they are not just in a phase, living out a fad, or what have you... that they are truly "meant to be" living as the opposite sex they were born as and it is absolutely the proper care to have them transition to avoid the unpleasant effects of a puberty that they do NOT want to go through and will cause them severe mental distress if allowed to do so.

These are, I'm sure, the cases in which they will be studied for years and years to come. My hypothesis, while based on feels at the moment and not any data that I have read, is that you will find the suicide rate of these patients MUCH lower than the trans population at large... because they will go through so much less social ostracism due to passing flawlessly and integrating into society much better than, say this poor individual:

This should be easily understood imo.

Foler · Apr 17, 2019

Vanessa said:
The best part of waking up, is coffee and FoH in my cup!

LoL, the posts were dropping quicker than zippers at a Gay-pride parade after party last night so I somehow missed this post. You actually made a funny post Foler, well done! But of course, you follow that gem with:

...and sink right back down to the depths of utter retardation in which you dwell daily. This post is so ass-backwards you've gone into sheer Poe's Law territory and you're right square back into the realm of not being able to tell if you're just trolling here or legitimately even more retarded than previously thought. Now go back into your playpen... adults are conversing here.

View attachment 203707

With more data and research and science (think: brain-scans), we can keep learning and getting more acute diagnosis for genuine GD sufferers vs. non GD sufferers.

One thing I think that I haven't touched on, that should be somewhat common sense but perhaps not as common as I may assume so it's worth stating... GD is like any other mental illness wherein you will find differing levels of severity in individuals. Someone could be suicidal depressed for days on end, and others could simply cry at night from time to time. Some people will have schizophrenia where it is manageable enough on lithium (or whatever they take) and function normally in society and some will probably be like our boy Tad10 and need constant care because they're extremely detached from reality.

There are clear cut kids out there where it will be patently obvious that they are not just in a phase, living out a fad, or what have you... that they are truly "meant to be" living as the opposite sex they were born as and it is absolutely the proper care to have them transition to avoid the unpleasant effects of a puberty that they do NOT want to go through and will cause them severe mental distress if allowed to do so.

These are, I'm sure, the cases in which they will be studied for years and years to come. My hypothesis, while based on feels at the moment and not any data that I have read, is that you will find the suicide rate of these patients MUCH lower than the trans population at large... because they will go through so much less social ostracism due to passing flawlessly and integrating into society much better than, say this poor individual:

View attachment 203708

This should be easily understood imo.

Tldr: honestly I prob wouldn't give you so much crap if you could just cut your damn posts down to one paragraph. This is 2019, u can't expect people to read all that. At the very least take a BuzzFeed approach and do bullet points.

Vanessa · Apr 17, 2019

Gamma Rays said:
Jeez Vanessa,

Why bother with all this? They're not going to listen, or come to your side. I can't see the need for you bringing all this grief on yourself.

The kernel of this argument/debate/shitshow started innocently enough: The GG/SJW thread regulars were on the topic of puberty blockers. I posed the question to them all wondering if they even knew WHY puberty blockers were used at all? I was legitimately unsure, based on the rhetoric (oh, this is frankensteinish science and child mutilation from crazy doctors!). It snowballed from there and culminated in LLR stating that "we're all sick of it, take this elsewhere". ...and here we are. There was history behind all of this though, just know that.

With that said, you're not wrong. Dom said this very early last night too. These people will be stuck in their preset ways and no matter how many pearls I cast to them, it will be trampled under the pig hoof. I'm only "grieved" by the notion of being silenced. The personal attacks are water dribbling down my back. I'll miss making fun of blue-hairs in the GG thread though. This thread is fine for me and my thoughts though, ultimately. Viva the tranny thread! Hah~

pysek · Apr 17, 2019

Again, I appreciate your response, but I feel like you're slightly dodging the question so I will state it bluntly, but I must reiterate, I state it bluntly but with respect: How many 'normal' kids who would adjust properly after puberty would you sacrifice so you and others who you believe have genuine GD can be afforded some comfort?

Also, would it be so hard to believe that even hardcore GD sufferers might later have regret? Or let me ask it this way, do YOU ever (even the teensiest bit) regret what you've done to your physical form in the name of your disorder? Can you envision a possibility where someone might have regrets?

All that to say (and yes, I did extend this post just to annoy foler, I love you foler you beta troll bastard) do you not think that in some ways you are asking (at least one probably many more) 'normal' kids to suffer for your comfort? And are you okay with that?

TrollfaceDeux · Apr 17, 2019

Vanessa said:
The kernel of this argument/debate/shitshow started innocently enough: The GG/SJW thread regulars were on the topic of puberty blockers. I posed the question to them all wondering if they even knew WHY puberty blockers were used at all? I was legitimately unsure, based on the rhetoric (oh, this is frankensteinish science and child mutilation from crazy doctors!). It snowballed from there and culminated in LLR stating that "we're all sick of it, take this elsewhere". ...and here we are. There was history behind all of this though, just know that.

With that said, you're not wrong. Dom said this very early last night too. These people will be stuck in their preset ways and no matter how many pearls I cast to them, it will be trampled under the pig hoof. I'm only "grieved" by the notion of being silenced. The personal attacks are water dribbling down my back. I'll miss making fun of blue-hairs in the GG thread though. This thread is fine for me and my thoughts though, ultimately. Viva the tranny thread! Hah~

What is the point you are making though.

To let kids undergo sex change?

Edit I read some of your stuff and it appears that you do to help them avoid "social pariah status".

Kind of funny though

This problem wouldn't exist if trannies didn't exist.

It's like self created problem and sex change is just a way of justifying your mental illness.

I don't understand why "trannies" like yourself won't just admit that you have mental issue and sex change was just a way of relieving your issues which 40% of people kill themselves over.

How is it justifiable to allow this insane practice that is quiet literally the bane of entire human biology.

Vanessa · Apr 17, 2019

pysek said:
Again, I appreciate your response, but I feel like you're slightly dodging the question so I will state it bluntly, but I must reiterate, I state it bluntly but with respect: How many 'normal' kids who would adjust properly after puberty would you sacrifice so you and others who you believe have genuine GD can be afforded some comfort?

Also, would it be so hard to believe that even hardcore GD sufferers might later have regret? Or let me ask it this way, do YOU ever (even the teensiest bit) regret what you've done to your physical form in the name of your disorder? Can you envision a possibility where someone might have regrets?

All that to say (and yes, I did extend this post just to annoy foler, I love you foler you beta troll bastard) do you not think that in some ways you are asking (at least one probably many more) 'normal' kids to suffer for your comfort? And are you okay with that?

My answer is complex... in the simplest answer that you are seeking I would say I would want zero "normal" kids to be sacrificed to afford very young trannies comfort. But you see the crux of this issue is that I can also say in that same breath that I would want to zero transkids to suffer just to entirely halt puberty blocker / HRT implementation either. It's not a willful dodging of any question (this entire thread is a testament to me answering any and all questions posed at me about anything and everything), it's that it's too complex to JUST say zero. Because here again, it sounds like what many of you are saying is "fuck the 20%... let them suffer" and as I stated before, you all tell me how THAT sentiment is NOT child abuse too? Because they're fucking weirdos with a mental problem? That shit ain't right either and you're back to square one dealing with suffering children.

I think anyone anytime could have later regret. You asked me personally, however, and can say no... never had regrets and I'm extremely happy with my life, how my transition went, and wouldn't change a thing. The ONLY thing I wrestled with was the moral dilemma of it all. Y'know... how to rectify or justify this choice with my relationship with God/Jesus. As we all well know, the church doesn't exactly condone transgenderism heh. I can safely say that, even with all that, that that issue is safely behind me too and everything jives quite well.

There's also another facet to all this that I have dwelled upon and it's difficult to describe (partly because it's a long explanation to begin with and partly because I'm still working out the "kinks" in it) but it would be well suited to a video moreso than a post. But in a nutshell it deals with exactly what you're asking and how to justify this scientifically and (more as to what the peanut gallery is pressing me on) ethically.

TrollfaceDeux said:
What is the point you are making though.

To let kids undergo sex change?

Edit I read some of your stuff and it appears that you do to help them avoid "social pariah status".

Kind of funny though

This problem wouldn't exist if trannies didn't exist.

It's like self created problem and sex change is just a way of justifying your mental illness.

I don't understand why "trannies" like yourself won't just admit that you have mental issue and sex change was just a way of relieving your issues which 40% of people kill themselves over.

How is it justifiable to allow this insane practice that is quiet literally the bane of entire human biology.

Panface, I don't mean this to be insulting, but based on what you say about this topic (and say often) you are either:

A) Dense as lead
B) Not paying attention
C) Thinking about all of this in entirely a backwards way.

I can't accurately discern exact what scenario is more likely with you.

"This problem wouldn't exist if trannies didn't exist"

Do you not understand that trannies have existed since at least Biblical times? I mean seriously, are you aware of this fact at all?

You say "this wouldn't exist if trannies didn't exist" as if we were beamed down by Scotty in the past 10 years and have the option to just pack up our things and be beamed up any time we're ready... I mean what the fuck?

Yeah man... you know, like, suicide wouldn't exist if depressed people didn't exist, man! <--- that's what you sound like.

Also, can someone besides ME inform Panface how many times on this forum I have said it's a mental illness? But you're asking me why can't I just simply admit that this is a mental illness? Ridiculous.

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