that sounds like the worst tragedy imaginable.
however, in terms of the president & his relationship to the house, senate & people... i don't think that is then our responsibility if we collectively decide to not engage Syria.
War with Syria
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however, in terms of the president & his relationship to the house, senate & people... i don't think that is then our responsibility if we collectively decide to not engage Syria.
Tuco
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What's the path to the least amount of lives lost in Syria?
Imo, it's for the rebels to see that the international community isn't going to help them and for them to give up.
TrollfaceDeux
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Swagdaddy
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Sounds like a Syrian problem, wish the US would go back to fixing our fucking problems like our decrepit infrastructure and the issue of generational welfare.
Tuco
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Here's another hypothetical that is as likely as the one you give: What if the rebels used the gas in the first place, congress votes yes, Obama follows through and we bomb some Syrian regime assets, then the war continues and when the rebels are losing again they use another gas attack?
I can't say I've heard the angle that the rebels gassed their own school in Aleppo. Or that they own the fighter jet which circled the school then dropped ordinance.
Tuco
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I haven't been following the evidence much, what evidence do you have of that? I'm not making the argument that the evidence doesnt' exist, just that I haven't seen it yet.
iannis
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I guess it depends on who you assume used the chemical weapons and why.
Either a rebel group used them or Assad's group did. If it was a rebel group, they used them either because they had them (which I find most likely) or as a gambit to force world powers to step into (and quell) the conflict. If Assad's government did use them then the only reason I can see he would have is to force Russia into an even stronger commitment than they already share. Basically, his war is all but won and he's bartering for the terms of his vassalage. Or it's possible that one of his commanders, after 3 years of ongoing war, just decided fuck it and went all My Lai.
So to answer the question what happens if Obama does nothing and more chemical weapons are used? Well, there is only 1 situation out of 4 possibilities in which Obama doing something would make a difference. That being that Assad is the one to have executed the attack. And in that case a reprisal might serve Assads interest as well as the weapons use to begin with.
More bombs don't fix this. Already too many bombs.
Either a rebel group used them or Assad's group did. If it was a rebel group, they used them either because they had them (which I find most likely) or as a gambit to force world powers to step into (and quell) the conflict. If Assad's government did use them then the only reason I can see he would have is to force Russia into an even stronger commitment than they already share. Basically, his war is all but won and he's bartering for the terms of his vassalage. Or it's possible that one of his commanders, after 3 years of ongoing war, just decided fuck it and went all My Lai.
So to answer the question what happens if Obama does nothing and more chemical weapons are used? Well, there is only 1 situation out of 4 possibilities in which Obama doing something would make a difference. That being that Assad is the one to have executed the attack. And in that case a reprisal might serve Assads interest as well as the weapons use to begin with.
More bombs don't fix this. Already too many bombs.
To be honest i guess I just assumed that since the weapon was deployed from a literal fighter jet, that it therefore was indisputably not owned by the rebels.
Tuco
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What evidence do you have that it was deployed from a fighter jet? I'm not arguing that it wasn't, just that I haven't seen the evidence.
iannis
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I'll admit it's a stretch about the plane-- but given the resources and determination of the rebel factions it's not an unthinkable possibility to me.
This is an entity which promotes martyrdom in irregular soldiers. Gassing their own people for the greater goal of victory... well, it doesn't seem entirely out of character to me.
Strifen
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Its definitely not out of the realm of possibility the rebels were involved with the gas attacks. People should read up more on Al-Nusra front (which is the largest group fighting Assad in Syria) and all of the horrible atrocities their leaders are committing. Be-heading POWS, killing Christian leaders in their "liberated area"... eating the hearts and liver of the Syrian Army soldiers they have killed. It's all document on line but these are some crazy fuckers.
The majority of the rebels fighting Assad are entirely aligned with these extremist Islamic beliefs. I would say a very small amount of the rebels fighting are actually Syrians at this point, Al-Nusra has killed off most of the moderate FSA commanders who were not aligned with their pro-Islamic beliefs. Most of the current fighters are shipped in from terrorist organizations funded by the west/Saudis. Despite what Assad has done in the past Syria has been a relatively peaceful secular state where Muslim, Christians and other religions have been allowed to live in peace over the years in Syria. If these Al-Nusra nut jobs get into power Syria likely won't be pulled out of whatever Dark Ages it gets sent back to for decades.
iannis
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Yeah. And that's a problem. We really have no fucking idea who DID it. We know that someone did.
So basically we have no grounds for a punitive action. We don't know who to aim the missiles at. Even if we did know exactly who to aim the missiles at -- it makes no difference since the other guy (who's just the same) will laugh his ass off about it and still use them. As far as plans go, it's not a great one.
If Obama did do it -- you think Assad is above packing likely targets with POW's or women/children who he's tired of having to feed?
Tuco
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Thanks. That's the only evidence I saw too.