Why do men keep putting me in the Girlfriend-zone?

Famm · May 25, 2013

khalid_sl said:
I like how if a guy did that stuff, you would just consider him a bad friend and move on. However, a girl is a bad friend and its a sign that its pointless to try and be a friend with any girl.

WHEN a guy does that stuff, he quickly catches on that he's dead weight and either works to improve his company or stops coming until he has his shit together to hang proper. Why? Cause other dudes won't suffer it, cover for him and/or make excuses. For a chick they will. I wouldn't consider him a bad friend, I'd feel the exact same way.

TrollfaceDeux · May 25, 2013

Xeldar_sl said:

moral crusaders bro, moral crusaders.

Zaara · May 25, 2013

I knew even before I clicked this shit that there was going to be one guy playing devil's advocate while the rest of the beta brigade was going ''Bitches ain't shit.''
Works both ways, gentlemen. You need to figure out what it is about yourself that attracts dumb bitches.

Tanoomba · May 25, 2013

Antarius_sl said:
This thread is useless without facts, I liked the facts a few pages back about single mothers more likely to raise troubled children (behavioral/emotional problems) than single fathers, I think it's a disturbing trend that more and more women are having children without any male present in the child's life, in some cities 75% of all children are currently being raised by single mothers, and I think that's scary considering how much worse those children do in life:

Here are some more facts:

It's ok guys, you don't have to be gay or a woman to be friends with women...

But if you have sexual thoughts about a woman (which Tanooba has admitted to doing), EVEN IF ONLY OCCASIONALLY or in the past, you do not, BY DEFINITION, have a platonic relationship with her. You cannot say that you have both had sexual thoughts about a person... and have a platonic relationship with them... THATS NOT HOW WORDS WORK. YOU CANNOT CHANGE THE DEFINITION OF WORDS JUST TO MAKE AN ARGUEMENT! If you have ever thought about a person sexually, you have a erotic relationship with them, even if you do not actually have sex, or kiss, or anything sexual. It's the thought that defines the type of relationship.

OK, while you didn't actually mention the definition of platonic, let's take a look:

dictionary
( usually lowercase ) purely spiritual; free from sensual desire, especially in a relationship between two persons of the opposite sex.

To be fair, that does mean that if you consider someone sexually attractive you can't have a platonic friendship with them. It doesn't say anything about "sensual desire" in the past. You can be "free from sensual desire" where it existed before. But you know what, that doesn't really matter. Even if I give you that having been attracted to someone in the past means you can't technically ascribe to having a "platonic" relationship with her, then what you're saying is that I have an "erotic relationship" with several women in my life who I personally consider to be good friends. They can have kids or have undergone dramatic life changes or be on the other side of the world or whatever, and even though I myself am married and not looking for alternative sexual conquests, what I call a friendship you insist I must refer to as an "erotic relationship"... OK, so?
Call them whatever you want. Hell, I felt like an awkward nerd before, but apparently I'm Don Juan. I'll just continue considering them my friends, and if it makes you happy you can call them erotic relationships. You can call them twisted perversions if you like. You can call them galaxial freeblesneets, what the fuck do I care? They're my friends.

Palum · May 25, 2013

Zaara_sl said:
I knew even before I clicked this shit that there was going to be one guy playing devil's advocate while the rest of the beta brigade was going ''Bitches ain't shit.''
Works both ways, gentlemen. You need to figure out what it is about yourself that attracts dumb bitches.

No, it's really simple actually. The population of women who A) capable of being a good friend to a male and B) not going to want to be fucked by said male is basically miniscule. The only thing that trumps part B is circumstance, and that's not really a platonic friendship, it's just a willful suppression of desire.

But seriously, I think half the problem is you people confuse 'friend' with 'acquaintance' like some Facebook assholes. If I considered everyone I ever was at a bar or movie or whatever at by happenstance I probably have a retarded number of friends. The real number of actual close friends is far, far less.

So I have to call bullshit on the whole 'oh I'm friends with tons of women' anyway on pure number theory. You are just acquaintances who act friendly.

khalid · May 25, 2013

Palum_sl said:
The population of women who A) capable of being a good friend to a male and B) not going to want to be fucked by said male is basically miniscule.

Except its silly to exclude them. I am not a caveman, I have control over myself. If a woman is capable of being a good friend to me, I won't simply exclude them from friendship simply because I am attracted to them. Its just ludicrous, because someone is attractive but taken you don't want to associate with them? If they had the exact same traits but were ugly, you would be okay with being a friend of theirs? I mean, do you motherfuckers even listen to yourselves?

The bottom line should always be "Are they capable of being a good friend to you?". If that is the case, done.

Kirun · May 25, 2013

Palum_sl said:
No, it's really simple actually. The population of women who A) capable of being a good friend to a male and B) not going to want to be fucked by said male is basically miniscule. The only thing that trumps part B is circumstance, and that's not really a platonic friendship, it's just awillful suppression of desire.

Bingo!

But seriously, I think half the problem is you people confuse 'friend' with 'acquaintance' like some Facebook assholes. If I considered everyone I ever was at a bar or movie or whatever at by happenstance I probably have a retarded number of friends. The real number of actual close friends is far, far less.

So I have to call bullshit on the whole 'oh I'm friends with tons of women' anyway on pure number theory. You are just acquaintances who act friendly.

This. Like I said, chicks you hang out with socially every few weeks or so? Yeah, those aren't "friends". "Couple-friends" are just as bad.

Famm · May 25, 2013

khalid_sl said:
Except its silly to exclude them. I am not a caveman, I have control over myself. If a woman is capable of being a good friend to me, I won't simply exclude them from friendship simply because I am attracted to them. Its just ludicrous, because someone is attractive but taken you don't want to associate with them? If they had the exact same traits but were ugly, you would be okay with being a friend of theirs? I mean, do you motherfuckers even listen to yourselves?

The bottom line should always be "Are they capable of being a good friend to you?". If that is the case, done.

You went from "associate with" to "being a good friend". Those aren't the same thing. A woman who I'm not banging will always have some reason she may be willing to throw me under a bus. Granted, she may never have reason to, but there's always someone in her life or someone she wants to obtain that she would step on me (literally or emotionally) over. You can't say that about a guy, some guys might be that way, but all women are either with you or you are part of her supporting cast. So yeah we can be "friends", but there's always a biochemical tension, no matter how miniscule, in action as well.

Chukzombi · May 26, 2013

if you have a wife or gf. and you happen to already be "friends" with a female, especially one who is even semi attractive, you can kiss being friends with that female goodbye. try telling your other that you cant take her out on a date because you promised Sally you were gonna spend the evening with her. even if you two are just gonna be playing monopoly. you can bet your woman is going to pitch a fit, break up with you or cut you off on getting any loving. why? because even chicks know there is a good chance that after monopoly is done there is gonna be some good old fashioned fucking going down.

and palum nailed it. acquaintances are not friends. a friend you can call up at 3am drunk and they wont hang up on you. heck they might even go join you. try that shit with an acquaintance and they will likely hang up on your ass and then talk shit about you to others on how much of a fucking alky you are

Xexx · May 26, 2013

Maester Chuk_sl said:
if you have a wife or gf. and you happen to already be "friends" with a female, especially one who is even semi attractive, you can kiss being friends with that female goodbye. try telling your other that you cant take her out on a date because you promised Sally you were gonna spend the evening with her. even if you two are just gonna be playing monopoly. you can bet your woman is going to pitch a fit, break up with you or cut you off on getting any loving. why? because even chicks know there is a good chance that after monopoly is done there is gonna be some good old fashioned fucking going down.

and palum nailed it. acquaintances are not friends. a friend you can call up at 3am drunk and they wont hang up on you. heck they might even go join you. try that shit with an acquaintance and they will likely hang up on your ass and then talk shit about you to others on how much of a fucking alky you are

I've had a best friend since middle school who is likely a 9/10 - At a recent party we were all chillin and he ask me to come over. Then hes like "did you fuck her?" im like...who?... and hes like "Insert name" - I said no, i see her as more like a sister or close family. So you could say the role you mentioned can be reversed for men as well. However it is far more common for the male to have to shy away from hot female friends if the wife feels "1 up'd" in any way. Women are far more hostile to women than men are to other men, its almost laughable.

Pennilenko · May 26, 2013

All types of relationships between men and women are complex and individually unique from one another. Trying to reduce the argument to simple generalities shows a fundamental lack of understanding our psychology and a lack of maturity. The proclamation that men can never be friends with women is just as false as the proclamation that only immature males view men as not being capable of friendships with women. The possibility of friendship between a male and a female needs to be analyzed in each individual instance. By keeping an open mind and understanding one's own level of maturity and emotional needs, a man can have a very successful friendship with one or more females, if the situation comes together in the right way. To this day, even though I am married, there are two female friends I can call in an emergency at any time for real friend assistance. These same females are also good friends with my wife. Adults with real lives and control over their impulses are capable of trouncing poorly created stereotypes.

Agraza · May 26, 2013

Tanoomba_sl said:
I have literally no idea who that is.

Shame on you. They are awesome.

Tanoomba · May 26, 2013

Maester Chuk_sl said:
if you have a wife or gf. and you happen to already be "friends" with a female, especially one who is even semi attractive, you can kiss being friends with that female goodbye. try telling your other that you cant take her out on a date because you promised Sally you were gonna spend the evening with her. even if you two are just gonna be playing monopoly. you can bet your woman is going to pitch a fit, break up with you or cut you off on getting any loving. why? because even chicks know there is a good chance that after monopoly is done there is gonna be some good old fashioned fucking going down.

Here's the problem with generalizing. Even if what you describe is true some of the time for some people, you're taking it as a given that what you have stated is a universal truth, which it very simply isn't. If I wasn't able to take my wife out because my male buddy wanted to hang out, there could easily be a conflict there too. On the other hand, if I made it clear ahead of time that I was meeting up with a friend one day, then it wouldn't matter if that friend was male or female. This isn't hypothetical, this is my life. When you say "even chicks know there is a good chance that after monopoly is done there is gonna be some good old fashioned fucking going down", you're wrong. "Chicks" don't "know" that. Both my wife and my female friends understand very well that there is no chance of me and my female friends fucking. Your assumptions are wrong, so any conclusions you derive from these assumptions are also wrong.

Maester Chuk_sl said:
and palum nailed it. acquaintances are not friends. a friend you can call up at 3AM drunk and they wont hang up on you. heck they might even go join you. try that shit with an acquaintance and they will likely hang up on your ass and then talk shit about you to others on how much of a fucking alky you are

If my closest buddy called me up at 3am drunk, I'd be pretty fucking pissed. Maybe it's because I'm not a teenager any more, but life is not a beer commercial. If I have to wake up at 6:00 because I work the next day, I'm not gonna laugh and say "Oh, you!" before humoring my buddy in a 2 hour conversation. On the other hand, if somebody who you would consider an "acquaintance" called me up at 3am because heOR SHEwas in trouble, I'd be up and ready to help. You're all relying on flawed assumptions and generalizations to make your points. it just doesn't work.

Again, we could look at dictionary definitions of friendships. We could sub-classify based on whether contact occurs through Facebook or 3AM drunken calls. We could talk about who's willing to help us move a couch. In the end, none of that matters. If I consider someone my friend (male or female) and they consider me their friend, then we are friends. If it makes you feel more comfortable to tell yourself "That guy's female friends aren'treallyfriends", fine. Tell yourself that. You don't know my friends. You don't know what we've been through. You don't know when we talk or why or about what. You are talking out your asses. But I'm not going to stop considering my friends my friends so your masculinity can remain unchallenged.

Pennilenko_sl said:
All types of relationships between men and women are complex and individually unique from one another. Trying to reduce the argument to simple generalities shows a fundamental lack of understanding our psychology and a lack of maturity. The proclamation that men can never be friends with women is just as false as the proclamation that only immature males view men as not being capable of friendships with women. The possibility of friendship between a male and a female needs to be analyzed in each individual instance. By keeping an open mind and understanding one's own level of maturity and emotional needs, a man can have a very successful friendship with one or more females, if the situation comes together in the right way. To this day, even though I am married, there are two female friends I can call in an emergency at any time for real friend assistance. These same females are also good friends with my wife. Adults with real lives and control over their impulses are capable of trouncing poorly created stereotypes.

+1

Palum · May 26, 2013

I'm going to call this logical fallacy the '50 Shades of Grey' technique. It's where you argue that the overwhelming majority of cases is invalidated by the mere existence of outliers.

Tanoomba · May 26, 2013

Palum_sl said:
I'm going to call this logical fallacy the '50 Shades of Grey' technique. It's where you argue that the overwhelming majority of cases is invalidated by the mere existence of outliers.

"Overwhelming majority"? Care to back that up with statistics? Oh wait, you can't because you're speaking out of your ass. Besides, the point several of you are trying to make is not "The majority of men can't be friends with the majority of women", it's "men and women can't be friends". Even if cases where men and women were friends were in the minority, the blanket statement is invalidated. If this were any other topic you guys wouldn't put up with wild and ridiculous generalizations in order to support a point for a second!

If you want you can fool around by putting down as many asterisks as you like:
Men and women can't be friends*
* unless the parties are not attracted to each other
* unless both parties are married
* unless the guy isn't a "real man"
* unless the female is "using" the male as an "emotional tampon"
* unless they're technically just "acquaintances" by some arbitrary definition
* unless they're friends, but not "platonic" friends according to the dictionary
* unless the guy is holding out hope that they'll fuck
* unless they are forced to spend time together (ie: they're co-workers)
Note that in all these cases, the man and woman involved are happy to call each other friends and don't give a shit about your "rules". If two people consider themselves friends, who are you to tell them they're not?

When you have to keep "qualifying" what you mean in order for your statement to work, eventually your original statement just doesn't hold any sway any more.
If you accept that some men can be friends with some women (and your statement implies that you do), then the statement "men and women can't be friends" is false.

Don't get me wrong, I'm happy to continue this discussion indefinitely, but you're going to have to come up with some better material.

Salshun_sl · May 26, 2013

This entire argument is intellectual bankruptcy. I just woke up on a friends couch, a female, and I have ZERO desire to fuck her. Maybe I'm the golden exception, but it exists. Never had, never will, ANY desire to fuck her. End of discussion. My existence is all the proof you need. Maybe once in a rare blue moon do I even hug her. It exists, knock this stupid ass discussion off.

Tanoomba · May 26, 2013

Salshun_sl said:
This entire argument is intellectual bankruptcy. I just woke up on a friends couch, a female, and I have ZERO desire to fuck her. Maybe I'm the golden exception, but it exists. Never had, never will, ANY desire to fuck her. End of discussion. My existence is all the proof you need. Maybe once in a rare blue moon do I even hug her. It exists, knock this stupid ass discussion off.

You're at least the fourth guy here to admit having female friends. Apparently none of these cases "count" for some reason or another.

Kirun · May 26, 2013

Salshun_sl said:
This entire argument is intellectual bankruptcy. I just woke up on a friends couch, a female, and I have ZERO desire to fuck her. Maybe I'm the golden exception, but it exists. Never had, never will, ANY desire to fuck her. End of discussion. My existence is all the proof you need. Maybe once in a rare blue moon do I even hug her. It exists, knock this stupid ass discussion off.

Is she hot?

Salshun_sl · May 26, 2013

Kirun_sl said:
Is she hot?

Fuck if I know, my brain literally cannot view her that way.

moonarchia · May 26, 2013

Pics will be required that we may render judgement.

Why do men keep putting me in the Girlfriend-zone?

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