Windows 8

Alkorin · Jan 31, 2013

IT is a world of variables. OS upgrades introduce way too many of them. So, I stand by the use of the word "suck". =)

In all honesty, you're right. For most people, it isn't truly an issue, but it's just not worth the risk in my opinion. I hardly trust Microsoft enough to get a clean install right without having to play around with the OS when I'm done -- so the idea of upgrading from one to another just doesn't work for me. I will always try to talk a client out of going the upgrade path for that very reason. Although I like the idea of them calling me over and over with problems that occurred as a result of upgrading, it can be a lot more work to troubleshoot.

Silence_sl · Jan 31, 2013

I just installed W8 on a separate drive on one of my laptops for dual boot W7 and W8. I used the upgrade version of W8 Pro that I bought last October and it dropped onto the 2nd drive without a problem. It did squawk at me for using a serial that's tied to another box, but a quick call to MS and the license was transferred from my desktop to the laptop. I should have grabbed an MSATA drive for W8, but I'm likely not going to use it much for anything other than testing.

I did an in-place upgrade on my main pc before, and all I had to do was re-activate MS Office 2010. Everything else got carried over, including my fairly complex network setup.

I took W8 off my main box because other than the fact that it's shit, it's far from being ready for prime time use.

Upshot of this on a newish laptop is everything worked on first boot; no drivers needed.

Alkorin · Feb 1, 2013

Silence_sl said:
I took W8 off my main box because other than the fact that it's shit, it's far from being ready for prime time use.

Explain in detail, please... I'm having no issues with Win8 on multiple boxes.

Frenzied Wombat · Feb 1, 2013

Yeah, it seems to be very stable to me. Been using it for about a month as my main work computer and have had zero bug/crash type issues. Some sites don't work well in IE 10 and require compatibility mode, and some admin consoles don't want to install (like Exchange 2010), but other than that the OS itself seems to be rock solid.

Alkorin_sl said:
Explain in detail, please... I'm having no issues with Win8 on multiple boxes.

Zodiac · Feb 1, 2013

OMG DUDE WHY WITH THE LATE QUOTES. You are making my brain hurt when scrolling down through threads.

Anyways, I've been running Win 8 at home and work since release and the only issue I have is that numlock is always off at the login screen. Doesn't matter what I set it to in the bios it like totally ignores it.

kegkilla · Feb 1, 2013

Zodiac_sl said:
OMG DUDE WHY WITH THE LATE QUOTES. You are making my brain hurt when scrolling down through threads.

Anyways, I've been running Win 8 at home and work since release and the only issue I have is that numlock is always off at the login screen. Doesn't matter what I set it to in the bios it like totally ignores it.

weird, mine is always on.

Alkorin · Feb 2, 2013

Try this to set numlock at login:

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/w...9-81e0c5e5d6a2

Luthair · Feb 5, 2013

I've been feeling the need to complain about Win8 for a little while now. I've been using Win8 on my personal laptop (x220) since the start of November; I was looking forward to the release, and I liked both XP and Vista from their releases. So I'm not really one to sandbag or hate on Microsoft. Unfortunately I think Windows 8 is seriously flawed from a usability perspective.

- Arbitrary barriers to distinguish between Metro and desktop applications (e.g. both show on alt+tab, only metro shows on meta+tab)
- Start Screen searches are categorized and results may not be shown (e.g. search for Windows Update)
- Login screen nearly always shows the updates avialable message, however nothing is shown upon login leaving the user to guess where it might be
- the ribbon is a monstrous waste of vertical space, on a standard laptop res (1344x768) a quarter of the screen is wasted with chrome
- the chrome on windows is ugly, Skype proves its possible to have a nice looking flat UI so why is everything so ugly?
- Start Screen will not launch a second instance of desktop apps (e.g. notepad)
- Clearly not made with mouse/trackpad users in mind: awkward horizontal scrolling, popout UIs in corners overlapping existing functions, metro app drag n' close, etc.

In addition for regular users:
- hiding things offscreen is bad, it requires the user know what to do without visual clues
- shortcut key usage is virtually mandatory
- wifi, clock & battery are not visible unless on desktop

We bought my mother (non-technical, but reasonably competent) a laptop in the fall and it would qualify for the $15.99 upgrade but even at that price it would be completely pointless. Similarly I ended up only purchasing a single license of Windows-8, short of Microsoft drastically overhauling the UI I can't see installing it on my desktop or work development laptop; reverting to Win7 or using the Win7 explorer hack is pretty much inevitable.

Zodiac · Feb 5, 2013

Remove all the metro apps and use it like Win 7. This is what people who have no problem with it are doing. The metro ui stuff isn't fleshed out well enough for PCs imo.

What are you talking about when you say "chrome on windows"?

Luthair · Feb 5, 2013

Zodiac_sl said:
Remove all the metro apps and use it like Win 7. This is what people who have no problem with it are doing. The metro ui stuff isn't fleshed out well enough for PCs imo.

What are you talking about when you say "chrome on windows"?

Since I can't come up with a good way of explaining it, I'm stealing from Wikipedia's disambiguation page:User interface chrome - the borders and widgets that frame the content part of a window

ShakyJake · Feb 5, 2013

Luthair_sl said:
Unfortunately I think Windows 8 is seriously flawed

This could explain why:

Zodiac · Feb 5, 2013

Ah. As someone who actually knows where most of the stuff is in the old menus, I still find the ribbon to be way more intuitive than searching through drop downs . As far as screen real estate is concerned you should try hiding the ribbon.

to

Blide_sl · Feb 5, 2013

I definitely won't argue that there's some features in Windows 8 that aren't particularly intuitive. I mean I literally just figured out tonight that you could have your desktop and apps up at the same time on the same screen. I just never noticed the option before since it doesn't show up if you have a window maximized. Granted it's not a feature I really see myself using but it would have at least been nice to know I could do that.

caramon13_sl · Feb 10, 2013

W8 definitely does have its quirks, though I've been running it since about the time it came out on my desktop and aside from the very annoying "search for apps" thing that replaces the start menu, it's not half bad.

brekk · Feb 11, 2013

Had to setup a Windows 8 AIO for an old customer last week at their house. They were coming from an 2005'ish Windows XP Dell Tower.

Here's a perfect example of how bad Windows 8 is.

The couple uses sbcglobal.net on att.yahoo.com as their primary email. IE10 is unstable with the web based email client for ATT accounts. The metro UI IE10 lacks compatibility mode, the Desktop IE10 can go into compatibility, but is still unstable. So I loaded their ATT email into the Mail app in Metro.

They recently switched to Comcast for internet, and need access to that email account for billing. So I try to load that email account into the mail app as well. Comcast only supports Pop3 by default, you have to register to join a beta to get access to Imap with a 3-4 day wait to get the Imap activated. The Metro Mail App is Imap only. So I had to bookmark their Comcast email in IE10.

I also copied over their favorites from the old computer. Much as I've done for any Windows 7 setup, however favorites only show up in the Desktop IE10, the Metro IE10 has its own recent/favorite list.

Shit is unacceptable. This is worse then Vista. The old couple mentioned that when they bought it at Staples they were offered a free hour of training at the store. It's bad.

I know, I know. It's great and we just need to learn how to use it. But here's the problem. For a techy like myself, its frustrating, and I'm used to working my way through software to learn it. But for the average customer, especially older people upgrading from old XP machines, it is a painful transition that they shouldn't have to make.

The dual UI is just asinine. Having the same program behave in two different way depending on where you open it with information not carrying over is so beyond stupid. I could see the blank stares on their faces when I tried to explain the two different IE10's.

Congratz Microsoft, Apple is floundering with lack of innovation, and instead of solidly updating the beloved Windows 7, you shit the bed hardcore, and lose your chance to steal back some market share from Apple while they struggle.

Agraza · Feb 11, 2013

That does sound nightmarish. MS, I am disappoint.

Zodiac · Feb 11, 2013

It's why I tell everyone who has loaded Win 8 to ignore all metro apps and use the desktop for everything.

Alkorin · Feb 11, 2013

Metro is for touch screens and purposefully oversimplified booth displays. Everyone else should ignore it completely and just use it like it's Windows 7 R2. Or Vista R3, whichever you prefer.

Frenzied Wombat · Feb 11, 2013

brekk_sl said:
Had to setup a Windows 8 AIO for an old customer last week at their house. They were coming from an 2005'ish Windows XP Dell Tower.

Here's a perfect example of how bad Windows 8 is.

The couple uses sbcglobal.net on att.yahoo.com as their primary email. IE10 is unstable with the web based email client for ATT accounts. The metro UI IE10 lacks compatibility mode, the Desktop IE10 can go into compatibility, but is still unstable. So I loaded their ATT email into the Mail app in Metro.

They recently switched to Comcast for internet, and need access to that email account for billing. So I try to load that email account into the mail app as well. Comcast only supports Pop3 by default, you have to register to join a beta to get access to Imap with a 3-4 day wait to get the Imap activated. The Metro Mail App is Imap only. So I had to bookmark their Comcast email in IE10.

I also copied over their favorites from the old computer. Much as I've done for any Windows 7 setup, however favorites only show up in the Desktop IE10, the Metro IE10 has its own recent/favorite list.

Shit is unacceptable. This is worse then Vista. The old couple mentioned that when they bought it at Staples they were offered a free hour of training at the store. It's bad.

I know, I know. It's great and we just need to learn how to use it. But here's the problem. For a techy like myself, its frustrating, and I'm used to working my way through software to learn it. But for the average customer, especially older people upgrading from old XP machines, it is a painful transition that they shouldn't have to make.

The dual UI is just asinine. Having the same program behave in two different way depending on where you open it with information not carrying over is so beyond stupid. I could see the blank stares on their faces when I tried to explain the two different IE10's.

Congratz Microsoft, Apple is floundering with lack of innovation, and instead of solidly updating the beloved Windows 7, you shit the bed hardcore, and lose your chance to steal back some market share from Apple while they struggle.

I don't know how many times it needs to be repeated, press the WINDOWS key and ignore Metro. Forever. Why anybody tries to load and use shit in metro rather than the normal desktop is beyond me. Metro is basically for tablet use, no reason to use it if you are using a PC. Should MS have included a way to disable it entirely in a desktop install? Sure, but it really is a moot point as it is so easily ignored by pressing the goddamned Windows key. If it allowed you to accomplish something that you couldn't with the desktop, then fine, complain. As it is, it's like some vestigial component meant for tablet use that you can just ignore while using Win 8 on your PC.

Sean_sl · Feb 11, 2013

Brekk, why in god's name were you trying to work with IE10 instead of just installing Chrome or Firefox and being done with it?

Windows 8

Chancellor Alkorin

Part-Time Sith

shitlord

Chancellor Alkorin

Part-Time Sith

Potato del Grande

Lord Nagafen Raider

The Big Mod

Chancellor Alkorin

Part-Time Sith

Lord Nagafen Raider

Lord Nagafen Raider

Lord Nagafen Raider

Lord Nagafen Raider

shitlord

shitlord

Dancing Dino Superstar

Registered Hutt

Lord Nagafen Raider

Chancellor Alkorin

Part-Time Sith

Potato del Grande

shitlord