World of Warcraft: Current Year

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Malkav

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Yeah, but at the same time players in "the good old time" put up with it. So why are players so enraged about grinding nowadays Torghast for 30 minutes each week, even if they can even choose when to do it? Probably because of multiple factors:

Players don't want to put up with what they perceive as "stupid grinds" anymore, especially when the game feels like full of them, and most of them are on a daily schedule: rep grind here, renown grind (which also feels randomized), world quest grind, soul ash grind. "Do this or you're not flying."

Also, bringing in catch-up mechanics for these grinds for all players just sitting out x.0 devalues the grind earlier players do. This led to the sentiment to wait until x.3, where all catch up is in place, play for a month or two and come back at the next expansion. This feels bad for players who really want to play the game now: "Why do we have to do all these grinds, when it's obviously just arbitrary design to keep us logging in daily?" Blizzard allowed players to peek behind the curtain, and now the magic is gone. The grinds don't feel rewarding anymore: When you see another player who went through that grind you don't feel kinship, but ask yourself if he got it easy by waiting it out.

Flying is another thing: Players expected that, but The Maw felt especially bad: Not only removing mounts, but also having a (perceived) timer breathing down their neck, limiting their time in the zone. One of the advertised new features of the new expansion felt oppressive, especially on the casual end of the players. This was the first time the casuals felt the "we'll make a timer to make it harder" mechanic of M+, (even if it wasn't a real time) and they hated it.

Agree with you on that. Some people will always have the capacity to poopsock (I'm looking at you EQ 24+ hours camps), but when your week in game is basically just doing your various grinds, people realize it's too much. It's not that singular "do this 30min activity weekly" it's the fact that his activity is on top of all the other activites you HAVE TO do this week. And once you fell behind, well, might as well wait for the catch-up mechanics to kick in as you said.
 
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TJT

Mr. Poopybutthole
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Hilarious how the tone deaf faggots at Bliz cannot understand why in 51 seconds of shitty animation and a forgettable raid boss Garrosh stole the show. I honestly have no idea how this made it into the game at this point.
 
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Chris

Potato del Grande
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View attachment 361575

Hilarious how the tone deaf faggots at Bliz cannot understand why in 51 seconds of shitty animation and a forgettable raid boss Garrosh stole the show. I honestly have no idea how this made it into the game at this point.
The talk about the story holding WoW back and how FF14 is an alternative when it has even more story is interesting. But this meme sums it up.

FF14 has way too many cutscenes for even minor quest stuff with one off side quest characters, too many for my taste and I do skip when I can.

BUT

FF14 does slowly build up and pay off plot points with the major story beats, to the point most players really love the main storyline by now. This is why it's blowing up now, because it's got critical mass of payoffs from Shadowbringers and it's patches.

WoW handled most quests better with the textbox detail if you want it and the characters talking/emoting in the game world with you having control over your character.

It also did have slow burn storylines like with Garrosh's rise to power starting in Burning Crusade, through Wrath and Cataclysm to Pandaria. Garrosh had a consistent character and they just paid it off (accidentally?) in the new raid.

Sylvanas has a botched storyline with her being very inconsistent in character, a Mary Sue, way too much focus on her and she's very stupid in her motivations. They also statted putting in no control cutscenes to show her off.

WoW also keeps having the same "corruption made them mad" storyline over and over again, while FF14 is very, very varied in antagonist motivations.

So basically, it's all in the execution of the storylines. FF14 does it well so you'll suffer through the unnessesary fetch quests and cutscenes, WoW does it so badly now that the entire game is being questioned.
 

Big Phoenix

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Thats what happens when you have literal retards write stories.

BFA should have been such an ez setup. Alleria/Turalyon should have gone into BFA trying to purge Lorderon of Horde the which starts a war with The Horde. You could have all sorts of drama with Sylvanas having to fight her sisters. That would be a great setup for surviving high elves to flock to Alleria and give you the playable race Alliance has always wanted.

But no. You got 75% story that was all about setting up the next xpac not telling its own story and 25% a throw away story line to an old god that had zero connection to basically anything else. You get stupid shit like void elves no one wanted and make zero sense.
 
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Cybsled

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That doesn’t work without a lot more story development. Unsanctioned attack means alliance denies responsibility and horde blames alliance.
 

Neranja

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Sylvanas has a botched storyline with her being very inconsistent in character, a Mary Sue, way too much focus on her and she's very stupid in her motivations. They also statted putting in no control cutscenes to show her off.
I think Sylvanas' storyline had not enought hints about what was really going on, with them probably thinking we all figure it out anyways, or they were going for the "mystery" route. That really backfired, because overstretching it over two years, like old gum on your shoe, made even the ones interested in the story resentful. Also, you mostly interacted with Nathanos, who ... let's just say everyone thought the character was an abrasive dickwolf and everyone is happy he is gone.

Here's how Sylvanas redemption will go down: Leaders convene what to do, Tyrande goes full bitch, everyone has to hold them back. Then they realize that they can't condem her for it, because: "When you sentence Sylvanas to death for what she dead while being controlled by the latest big bad, then what will you do with Anduin?"

I'd say sentence them both to death, because it is more merciful than letting them live with the memories and guilt of what they have done. Do some rounds of Kyrian brainwashing after that.
 
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Big Phoenix

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That doesn’t work without a lot more story development
Whats there to develop? Theyre zealots who have been crusading for centuries that come home to find their homelands controlled by what should be abominations in their eyes. What was the point of crusading for centuries if you let the people who massacred your family rule your homeland?
 
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Araxen

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How Sylvanas have any redemption arc is baffling. She burnt down the Night Elf city. How can someone be redeemed after they do that?
 
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Chris

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Thats what happens when you have literal retards write stories.

BFA should have been such an ez setup. Alleria/Turalyon should have gone into BFA trying to purge Lorderon of Horde the which starts a war with The Horde. You could have all sorts of drama with Sylvanas having to fight her sisters. That would be a great setup for surviving high elves to flock to Alleria and give you the playable race Alliance has always wanted.

But no. You got 75% story that was all about setting up the next xpac not telling its own story and 25% a throw away story line to an old god that had zero connection to basically anything else. You get stupid shit like void elves no one wanted and make zero sense.
Yeah, "What happens when the Warcraft 2 Heroes of the Alliance return from fighting The Burning Legion?" is really interesting.

They literally had statues of the 5 of them outside Stormwind since vanilla.

They already had a similar scenario with another Warcraft 2 character, Admiral Proudmoore, finding the new horde in Warcraft 3 and automatically attacking them. Something they paid off amazingly with the Jainia sea shanty trailer for BfA and barely mentioned again.

So you got a setup with all that for history to repeat itself and The Alliance be the bad guys for a change. Maybe Jaina helps them to make amends for betraying her father and to avenge Theramore.

Khadgar is neutral in TBC/Legion so he's the voice of reason but has unshakeable loyalty to the other 4. Danath and Kurdran had been fighting Illidari Orcs and come home to find their homelands ruined by the Forsaken/Dragonmaw Clan Orcs. Alleria has her homeland destroyed by the undead, one sister being an undead abomination leading the Forsaken/Horde and the other is a widow because of The Horde. Turalyon is married to Alleria and is probably a religious zealot at this point.

So yeah, the Alliance's Warlords of Draenor are back and kicking Horde ass reclaiming their homes. Anduin loses control of The Alliance and is a weak unproven king compared to the literal living legends of the city, statues come back to life.

I guess that the Stromgarde Battlefront was kind of that? I didn't play that patch but I don't think it had any story focus? I did watch a bunch of cutscenes about Sylvanas.
 

TJT

Mr. Poopybutthole
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That doesn’t work without a lot more story development. Unsanctioned attack means alliance denies responsibility and horde blames alliance.
People still QQ about Garrosh manabombing Theramore like it was the worst war crime in WOW history up until Sylvanas burned their stupid ass tree down.

Somehow they seem to forget that Theramore was a literal fortress and the barrens had an Alliance invasion force crawling all over it. Tauren in the south of the Barrens were reduced to guerilla warfare and hiding in the hills to avoid the Alliance forces.

Dumbass Thrall allowed them to fortify after the Cataclysm because they needed a place to live. When given this mercy they immediately use it to attack Horde in the barrens and take their shit. So one day for no reason at all Garrosh burned their shit to the ground.
 
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Merrith

Golden Baronet of the Realm
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How Sylvanas have any redemption arc is baffling. She burnt down the Night Elf city. How can someone be redeemed after they do that?

Clearly because half her soul was missing, which nobody would have any idea about because they're stupid and put most if it in the novels they expect people to read to keep up with the story (or something).

It's all just bad and doesn't make much sense.
 

Chris

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People still QQ about Garrosh manabombing Theramore like it was the worst war crime in WOW history up until Sylvanas burned their stupid ass tree down.

Somehow they seem to forget that Theramore was a literal fortress and the barrens had an Alliance invasion force crawling all over it. Tauren in the south of the Barrens were reduced to guerilla warfare and hiding in the hills to avoid the Alliance forces.

Dumbass Thrall allowed them to fortify after the Cataclysm because they needed a place to live. When given this mercy they immediately use it to attack Horde in the barrens and take their shit. So one day for no reason at all Garrosh burned their shit to the ground.
The Horde were invading Ashenvale and Gilneas/Hillsbrad/Arathi.

The Barrens humans in vanilla at least were from Kul Tiras (who had left The Alliance and only rejoined in BfA) and not Theramore.
 

Big Phoenix

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They already had a similar scenario with another Warcraft 2 character, Admiral Proudmoore, finding the new horde in Warcraft 3 and automatically attacking them. Something they paid off amazingly with the Jainia sea shanty trailer for BfA and barely mentioned again.
And they butchered that. They retconned him into a 1 dimensional cartoon bigot.
Clearly because half her soul was missing, which nobody would have any idea about because they're stupid and put most if it in the novels they expect people to read to keep up with the story (or something).
Yeah thats another incredibly idiotic thing about Blizzard. Most of the story is told in their novels few people read, not in actual game.
 
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Cybsled

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Right. It’s fine to have novels, but like take WOTLK. Rhonin shows up. Book readers know who he is, players wouldn’t. Then he was killed in a book, not in the game.

It’s stuff like that which disconnects players from the story, because the story itself is disconnected across media types
 
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Aaron

Goonsquad Officer
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The only time I really had fun in World PVP in WoW was in Vanilla, pre AV when you had these huge ass battles in Southshore between the Alliance and Horde towns. Hundreds of people on both sides with the ebb and flow of battle running between the two towns. Sometimes one side would get the advantage and be able to slaughter some of the NPCs but then it would quickly flow back. This then evolved into the 24+ hour AV sessions later. Loved those times, but I understand why many didn't and favoured the shorter 10-20 minute BGs.
 

Big Phoenix

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Right. It’s fine to have novels, but like take WOTLK. Rhonin shows up. Book readers know who he is, players wouldn’t. Then he was killed in a book, not in the game.
Hilariously thats not the first time they did that. They killed Alexstraza's consort in Cata's novel. Hes right beside her in WoTLK giving you quests then poof doesnt exist in Cata.
 

Cybsled

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Yup, he was another. Also Theramore being bombed (which killed Rhonin) also involved that blue dragon dude that was maybe or maybe not romantically involved with Jaina. He just shows up one day in the game but virtually all his backstory was books/manga.
 

Mist

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The only time I really had fun in World PVP in WoW was in Vanilla, pre AV when you had these huge ass battles in Southshore between the Alliance and Horde towns. Hundreds of people on both sides with the ebb and flow of battle running between the two towns. Sometimes one side would get the advantage and be able to slaughter some of the NPCs but then it would quickly flow back. This then evolved into the 24+ hour AV sessions later. Loved those times, but I understand why many didn't and favoured the shorter 10-20 minute BGs.
There was actually a bunch of fun World PvP content in BFA. Battle for Nazjatar was one example, but it always lagged out due to the zone lag issues that BFA had. The Alliance/Horde zone assaults in war mode were pretty cool, the weekly quests to kill X members of the enemy faction in relevant zones for that season, bounty system, etc.

The bounty system carried over to SL, but wasn't active in the one zone where it would have mattered last season, The Maw. Having griefers and campers in The Maw tagged as bounties would have done a lot to control some of the more annoying behaviors in the zone. It's funny how Blizzard has all sorts of good WPVP systems in place and then doesn't use them correctly.
 

Big Phoenix

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Yup, he was another. Also Theramore being bombed (which killed Rhonin) also involved that blue dragon dude that was maybe or maybe not romantically involved with Jaina. He just shows up one day in the game but virtually all his backstory was books/manga.
Oh god thats probably the biggest what the fuck in WoW's story.

Yeah he first shows up in Sunwell as a boss then at the end of it you hear him talking about how he loves Anvina or whatever her name was before she dies on the KJ fight. Everything about that is explained in comics so just playing through Sunwell its just 100% pure wtf cringe.
 
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Gavinmad

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So what can they copy off for the motive? How about Warhammer again?

Warhammer had a reboot a few years ago where everyone died and the world was remade. However a handful of prominent characters became the Gods of the new reality.
This was wildly unpopular and their entire player base fucking hated it, and Age of Sigmar (the replacement for Warhammer Fantasy) is not popular at all.

Which would make it a perfect move for Blizzard.
 
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