Ashes of Creation

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Vinjin

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The cash is a big gripe for me but also the timeframe. Now as someone who cut his teeth in this space on UO and EQ and numerous games since, I completely understand that you cannot have a shitty, bug-ridden launch if you're to have any chance of long term success.

But nine fucking months projected for Alpha 2 to last?? Is that normal in this space? Fuck, how long are they expecting Beta to last?

By those timeframes, I'd say anything prior to 2026 is a pipe dream. Not to mention a game that by the time it will have launched (assuming it even does), a small percentage of players will have been playing for well over 2 years already.

Maybe I'm not seeing it the way I should but this info irks the fuck out of me.
 
Ome

Ome

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Grats to the idiots I mean pioneers who will be paying $120 for just an alpha. We are counting on you brave souls!
 
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rhinohelix

rhinohelix

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Cybsled said:
They've probably got a pretty base game in place but need extra cash to deliver on most of the content promises. I strongly suspect the alpha test will be extremely basic - hack&slash and some really basic building mechanics.
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Have you seen the gameplay during any of the livestreams? I don't think they need the money; if anything, I think they are charging that much to prevent people who just want to "play the game" and aren't down to be testers from joining in. If they needed the money, they could Star Citizen it up and sell Beta entry and retail currency and node buildings, etc. This price is just to prevent "lookie lous" at this point, IMO.
 
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Bubbles

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they probably realized some time ago that the game is gonna be absolute dog shit. The feature and scope creep did them raw. Then they postponed the alpha 2 or whatever it's called in order to figure out if they are gonna either do damage control or cash in. It appears they chose the latter. First they milked suckers with cosmetics, now they have moved on to much more straight forwards pay models. Game should have come out 4 years ago. Back then it had potential. Right now almost everything shown gameplay wise looks outdated and mid at best. Even the dynamic changes happening in the game world and such are turning into whatever with every passing year. They are years away from release. And it's gonna get worse for them.
Also one of reasons why they didn't include playtime on release in those alpha keys is legal. After the alpha is over they don't own anything to the players/buyers. And they can charge again for alpha 3, beta 1 to x and then early access and finally release.
You're better off giving your money to Star Citizen
 
Aazrael

Aazrael

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Nice to have 2 MMO scams up at the same time. They should combine to a Super Scam, Pantheon of Creation.
 
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Daidraco

Daidraco

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rhinohelix said:
Have you seen the gameplay during any of the livestreams? I don't think they need the money; if anything, I think they are charging that much to prevent people who just want to "play the game" and aren't down to be testers from joining in. If they needed the money, they could Star Citizen it up and sell Beta entry and retail currency and node buildings, etc. This price is just to prevent "lookie lous" at this point, IMO.
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I think it's more of a cost point, since we dont have a real idea for how long Alpha will be. If its 9 months, like someone said above - thats basically a player paying roughly 13 bucks a month to a sub. Keep in mind people are actively talking about playing WoW again. MMO landscape is so barren right now that they arent even getting shit on for saying so.

But this game? All this doom and gloom is nothing new, and a comparison to Star Citizen is laughable at best but I wouldnt expect any different. Shit, Vanguard had a lot of the same people praising it in its early development, only to turn into the scorned women that parroted "too much brown" after a while. Hell, now that Im thinking about it - I see a couple faces talking shit that actively talked about the money they spent on EQ:Next - as fucking if that was EVER more than just a tech demo.

My point? You dont need to white knight the game. If its shit, its shit. If its a scam, its a scam. But Alpha 2 has a release date and we'll get all the answers we need then. Which is much more than EQ:Next gave them, and the game looks leagues better than Vanguard ever did at any point in its timeline.
 
Mahes

Mahes

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I look at it this way. Does this game have the potential to be a fantastic game? Yes it does. That right there is better than anything else coming anytime soon. There is nothing big for the MMO market, coming after Throne and Liberty, for a very long time. There is certainly nothing coming from the United States for a long time.

I will give props to the people making Throne and Liberty. They seem to have listened and are at least trying to fix what was initially broken. They might not succeed but at least they did not just release it. I am still considering giving the game a shot now that AoC's Alpha 2 is going with phases and a timed play schedule, until next May.

Could AoC be dogshit? Yes it can. It takes a tremendous amount of money and manpower to create a great MMO nowadays. That is why you do not see a ton of MMO's trying to come out. That being said, until A2 starts and the NDA drops, it is difficult to judge how awful or potentially great this game could be.

Given the environment, I would rather have hope, than shit on a bed not even made yet.

What fantastic MMO in the next 4 years are you planning to play???
 
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Grim1

Grim1

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Daidraco said:
Any notable source for that? If they are, its whatever. The game looks "foundationally" pretty solid when it comes to seeing leaks and not curated content from the company itself. I've looked into these claims a couple times and they are always dead ends with some no-name journalist basically being Mr. Sox. Last I read, Steven Sharif is still mostly preoccupied with his real estate and he supposedly brought in "tens of millions" in 2023. That could just as well be hearsay, too, though.


I think theyre going to cut back a lot of the world size and some features like you mentioned, Deep Water Naval Combat. If we go by what they've designed in the SW Corner of the map - those areas seem mostly put together, with dungeons, mob camps, triggered quests, etc. With how much content has went into those areas, its hard for me to believe that they are going to repeat that 10 times over before an actual release.

I do agree that release isnt looking good for 2026 with what has been currently promised, but we'll have 24/7 access. Which, if the game needs to go down the "Release in chunks" - I'll completely understand.
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I doubt they are starving for cash as Fucker stated. If that were the case then they wouldn't have stopped the preorder stuff. But they are a business and they do want to make money. There is demand for Alpha access and Star Citizen has shown that people will pay a stupid amount of money for pixels for a game far from release. So why not make money off of them. And getting people to pay to test the game for you has become a thing, so give the people what they want and charge too much for it. Basic business 101.
 
Ragosh

Ragosh

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It's been clarified that buying any key gives access to all the subsequent phases. beta included. (reddit source)

$120 buys you like a happy meal these days, doesnt it?
 
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Daidraco

Daidraco

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Ragosh said:
It's been clarified that buying any key gives access to all the subsequent phases. beta included. (reddit source)

$120 buys you like a happy meal these days, doesnt it?
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I already have a key, but that was my gripe about it. He changed his mind on it, though. Cause he very clearly said in the AMA video that it did NOT include Beta. Seems quite a lot of people were of a similar mindset to me.

Shit, this was one of the first videos that came up on my subscriptions this morning:


The whole situation is a bit double edged though. Cause now those keys have the same access as those of us that spent more on the game. So now we're feeling disenfranchised. All of this sounds like a lose/lose situation for them.
 
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D

Duskoy

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This just fucked the game for me. I’m fine with people buying cosmetics bundlds that come with the actual game, in game credits, subscription time and beta/alpha access but to stricktly offer Keys for Alpha/Beta at a premium cost? Go eat a fat dick. Another potential MMO bites the dust
 
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Gravel

Gravel

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It's similar to the First Descendent debacle. Once you set a price floor, you're kind of fucked. And if you do change it later, everyone prior will be pissed.

In this case though, it's not even the base game yet.
 
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D

Duskoy

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Gravel said:
Gravel said:
It's similar to the First Descendent debacle. Once you set a price floor, you're kind of fucked. And if you do change it later, everyone prior will be pissed.

In this case though, it's not even the base game yet.
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Exactly. Way to ass fuck the game into oblivion. Maybe that cunt mr sox from Boston was right about this game and the sniviling CEO Steven
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Mahes

Mahes

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Duskoy said:
This just fucked the game for me. I’m fine with people buying cosmetics bundlds that come with the actual game, in game credits, subscription time and beta/alpha access but to stricktly offer Keys for Alpha/Beta at a premium cost? Go eat a fat dick. Another potential MMO bites the dust
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Wow you are petty.

A charge plan, that has no effect on the actual game, ruined the game for you? How exactly? It had nothing to do with game play. People paying the $120.00 do not get characters that can instantly kill any target while wearing the armor of gods. It is access only to a game that is still very unfinished.

If you do not want to pay the cost.............then don't. There are many people who will not. That is kind of the idea behind the cost. They do not need 1 million players slamming their limited amount of servers. They want testers and players who care enough to actually help them out. Will every person who plays, think that way? Probably not, but hopefully enough will.

The company is a business. Star Citizen is a prime example(Despite the conspiracy theories around money laundering) of what people will pay. If they can make money with an idea, then they would be pretty stupid not committing to the idea. The problem is not that they are doing this. The problem was coming up with a cost that was fair to those who had already paid, and creating an artificial limit to prevent way to many testers from joining, while still getting enough to stress the test. I am sure many meetings were had discussing a number that would strike the right balance.

I assure you they will get 100's if not 1000's who will pay the cost, if not right away, then come May 1st 2025. Given that there is a very real chance that the Alpha 2 phase 3 portion of the testing will last at least 1 year, I do not see how the cost is a problem. That is more than a lot of streaming services.

Unless of course you cannot afford it........
 
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Burns

Burns

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Shitty business practices are shitty. Alpha testers should be vetted and demonstrate some skill/willingness at actually testing things. Selecting testers based on who is willing to pay to play an super unfished game is a vastly inferior way to make the product and looks like a money grab, not anything of real value.

Getting players to test your shit is shady; I don't care how excepted it is. Making them pay for the privilege to test it, and then have to pay for the released game separately is maximum scumbag CEO/company behavior.
 
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Mahes

Mahes

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Yet, if the game released actually ends up being a good...great game, every person complaining about the cost for Alpha 2 will be playing the game. I do not care if they charged $100,000 for Alpha 2 access. I care about how the game eventually comes out.

In the end, that is all that really matters.
 
Nirgon

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Cinge said:
$120 to alpha test a game, just alpha test, nothing else. Insanity.

Be different if that $120 came with beta accees then a headstart for release at minimum(need in game stuff too) but wow just nothing.
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The point is being a supporter. That might be meaningless to most.

You also are paying to have a lot of prelaunch knowledge to get ahead.

All of this is very entertaining for me, Pantheon aside.

Blizzard getting bought out and thoroughly DEI'd has had quite the ripple effect.
 
Burns

Burns

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Mahes said:
Yet, if the game released actually ends up being a good...great game, every person complaining about the cost for Alpha 2 will be playing the game. I do not care if they charged $100,000 for Alpha 2 access. I care about how the game eventually comes out.

In the end, that is all that really matters.
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It's funny people think that everyone is just like them, and so invested in the game or the genre that nothing but the results mater. It is certainly not that case and some people that are lukewarm on the game may see this and write the whole thing off.

I wont be paying for this game, from what I have seen, since I don't much care for PvP and even if I wanted to, I don't have the internet connection to PVP for the foreseeable future. So it doesn't matter one way or the other for me, but I could see how this paid alpha could turn someone off, if they were just on the "will probably play" side of the fence.
 
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Mahes

Mahes

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Trust me, the game is still a LONG way off from being done. People are acting like Alpha 2 is a complete game. It is nowhere even close. The only reason to be upset is to think that you are getting a full game and somehow being cheated out of the game because they are charging more for it. They care about what people think, but the game in its current iteration is not the game that will be released. It has parts of it, but so much is left to be done.

They will care a lot more about what people(not testing) think, when the game is in Beta(Only because it is supposed to be feature complete) or officially released.

Being Lukewarm on an unfinished product is pretty worthless. Why even have an opinion on something not finished? We have, most likely, over 2 more years before this game actually comes out. That is something perhaps to get upset at.

Also, results do matter. Ask CD Projekt RED about how results matter. Ask Amazon how New World is going.
 
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Cinge

Cinge

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Sorry, considering I think you are probably hundreds of dollars in right now, at least. I can't take anything you say about this game seriously. When you are that invested you are going to try your hardest to try to look at it in any good angle.

No matter what charging that much for purely an alpha phase access? Its not even all that access just that phase. Is asinine.

I want a good game as much as anyone, but I can see the ridiculousness of this. The early packages that had a ton of stuff in them including beta, alpha accesss, those were fine for the most part for what is essentially a kickstarter game. But this? No, this is either pure greed or desperation.
 
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