EQ Never

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Your second sentence made you look like a complete douche and a part of the people who you bashed in your first sentence. You stop playing games when YOU have everything you want.So I presume your guildmates gear you up then you quit? Awesome job bro, way to be a team player with loyalties.Please tell me the post is just phrased wrong.
hey genius the only mmorpg i mentioned was Vanguard which released enough content where my guild, Brotherhood of the Spider, conquered it in less than 3 months. Literally completely, everyone had every item they wanted with full player houses on our own island with no competition. So fuck off on that point.

Next, which guild were you part of in Farcry 3 and Final Fantasy VII?

Read more.
 

Bellringer_sl

shitlord
387
0
hey genius the only mmorpg i mentioned was Vanguard which released enough content where my guild, Brotherhood of the Spider, conquered it in less than 2 months. Literally completely, everyone had every item they wanted with full player houses on our own island with no competition. So fuck off on that point.

Next, which guild were you part of in Farcry 3 and Final Fantasy VII?

Read more.
So basically you do not refute your general statement of "I stop playing games when I have everything I want."?

Okay thanks.
 

Heallun

Lord Nagafen Raider
1,100
1,073
3 out of 5 classic EQ hardcore PvPers agree: we won't see a system like classic EQ again.

I think the unlimited level range thing works with factions, but I also think 2 faction systems are DEAD. One side will always be larger, and some much more so/out of proportion (hi2u evil race team on pvp server, duh) but at least the 2nd, 3rd and even 4th factions run into each other at times and have some good fights on a multi-team server.

The open world system is good for this, as long as there aren't "objectives" aka zerg points... or you go with the system Warhammer finally implemented with supply lines. Also, if there are multi-faction servers (and there, so help me god better not all 2 faction Horde/Alliance style servers), they need to be sure to show on server select which team has X number of active players (update it per week imo). This high/low doesn't help as the game goes on because the more relevant issue becomes "who has the most high level players at prime time". But, like I continue to preach, make it FFA and open world without zergable Wintergrasp-like content. Having a strong number of players should be a good thing, but not at the expense of losing targets. Further, PvP really shouldn't even be mandatory or have its own gear set. However, you should be able to take a piece of gear from people.

To this day I can't understand making a grindable system like battlegrounds when the most fun is definitely random world pvp encounters.
To answer your last question...

It's because the whole fucking genre is filled with people who hate mmo's fundamentally. They like the idea of persistence (of character) and progression but dislike actually interacting with the world they're playing in. Most don't even want to play or learn the game, just continue forward and get +1, +2, +3 broadswords. It's that base, loot hungry addiction which has been strangling mmo's ever since Zynga raped a generation of housewives running a virtual farm. And it's only going to get worse.

edit: I write this with a bit of vitriol after having just tried the Pandaria raid finders. They've crossed a terrible threshold, Arthas :3
 
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So basically you do not refute your general statement of "I stop playing games when I have everything I want.". ?

Okay thanks.
you've made no point, whatsoever. and honestly the idea that you THINK you've made a point is laughable.

when was the last time in an MMORPG you had absolutely nothing to do on your to do list? that's how little content Vanguard was released with.
 

Bellringer_sl

shitlord
387
0
you've made no point, whatsoever. and honestly the idea that you THINK you've made a point is laughable.

when was the last time in an MMORPG you had absolutely nothing to do on your to do list? that's how little content Vanguard was released with.
All you really need to say is that you have loyalties to people who help you get that gear that you want. I even gave you the benefit of the doubt in hoping that I just misinterpreted your post. Saying "I quit when I get what I want" can easily be taken for you being a douche, especially by former EQ players who have had people get geared up then "K bye, I retire." That gear cannot be put to good use to help others in the guild get gear.

Hope that clears things up, douchetool. =P
 
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you created quite the story based on knowing near nothing about my history with MMORPGs aside from Vanguard.

gold star
 

Quaid

Trump's Staff
11,751
8,192
Meh people are just limited in their own minds, and are totally thinking inside the box because they have been programmed to by years of shitty games.

Yes, maybe forests are important to crafters. Hamlets and villages IRL have popped up beside all nature of naturals resources, including timber. Perhaps settlements will pop up near particularly valuable deposits of trees. The same cold be said for strategic rivers, ore deposits, fonts of magic, etc etc.

Yes, perhaps they could be burned down. You honestly believe they wouldn't put systems in place to combat griefing because of this? It'd be as simple as giving Druids a rain spell that causes the weather to change and quench the fire. Or give them a spell to quickly regrow trees. Your village needs those trees to remain economically healthy? Better pay a druid to regrow that shit. Overhead, motherfucker.
 

Bellringer_sl

shitlord
387
0
you created quite the story based on knowing near nothing about my history with MMORPGs aside from Vanguard.

gold star
Correct. I can only go by your words, which reflected that you quit when you get what you want. Dude wtf?

To answer your last question...

It's because the whole fucking genre is filled with people who hate mmo's fundamentally. They like the idea of persistence (of character) and progression but dislike actually interacting with the world they're playing in. Most don't even want to play or learn the game, just continue forward and get +1, +2, +3 broadswords. It's that base, loot hungry addiction which has been strangling mmo's ever since Zynga raped a generation of housewives running a virtual farm. And it's only going to get worse.

edit: I write this with a bit of vitriol after having just tried the Pandaria raid finders. They've crossed a terrible threshold, Arthas :3
This hits on the fact that people want to complete all content solo in a MMO. Raid finders, group finders, everything about wow now requires you to have no guild, no friends, just solo play. What's the fucking point? Go play a single player game.
 

zzeris

King Turd of Shit Hill
<Gold Donor>
19,593
78,756
Azeth,

How dare you quit FF7 when you got bored!!! Same with Farcry. Don't you know children are depending on you to keep playing games when you don't want to??!! Don't you know Vanguard turned it around in month 4?! WTF!!
 
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Correct. I can only go by your words, which reflected that you quit when you get what you want. Dude wtf?
right because my quote "everyone in my guild had every item they wanted including extras like player housing" implies i bailed. additionally, it's clear you've considered all angles such as "was azeth the only one to quit or did his whole guild?"

keep on trolling me.
 

Seananigans

Honorary Shit-PhD
<Gold Donor>
13,333
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Yes, you can kill the people burning down the forest. Does it respawn instantly? Are you protecting the forest for a reason? Are you protecting every forest in the game world because people are destroying them for no reason? All of your solutions are aimed at normal people, not Trolls. Does the game know you are Trolling and it keeps you from respawning once killed? Does burning down forests give you a respawn timer increase, or flag you as a Troll? Does accidentally burning down a forest flag you as a Troll regardless, or flag you for PVP regardless, or give you faction hits regardless? What about NPCs? What if someone trains a mob that shoots fireballs around through forests intentionally? What if this happens when you are asleep? What if...

No, you haven't thought it through, and you are putting way too much freedom in the hands of a populace that -will- do all of the above, especially in a F2P game. It isn't remedial to apply common sense to a no-brainer issue when dealing with human nature. Especially online human nature. Take the worst, then aim for the best. But you -have- to take the worst into account.
Of course everyone's online persona is much more dickish than in person, and there are MANY more people who would engage in this destructive stuff online. But there are so many simple ways to make it lean in favor of the "good guys", some of which were already mentioned.

How about it takes a bit of time to light a tree on fire (similar to interruptible flag captures in WoW's BG's or whatever), and then when you DO get one lit, it takes awhile for it to spread. Then in addition, make putting out the fires a much easier task than setting fire to it. It might be just a tad unrealistic, but the side effect is it's a fun accomplishment when you finally DO succeed in burning down a small portion of a forest or whatever before the good guy police come and stop you.

Especially powerful and destructive fire spells/items/whatever could be hard to come by (via reagents or whatnot, as mentioned above?), and could decrease time / increase chance of spreading and stuff. But then you still retain the mechanics of it being easier in general to put out the fires than to start/spread them. So the "bad guys" save up for awhile and unleash a few uber-spells on your forest, and get a good head start, but if the "good guys" are vigilant, they'll probably still be able to come stop it before it gets out of hand.

Plenty of ways to make that sort of thing work. Not to mention dynamic growth speeds based on overall destruction rates.
 

Bellringer_sl

shitlord
387
0
right because my quote "everyone in my guild had every item they wanted including extras like player housing" implies i bailed. additionally, it's clear you've considered all angles such as "was azeth the only one to quit or did his whole guild?"

keep on trolling me.
Well okay. I am glad you cleared it up. I apologize for misinterpreting a statement separate from the one referenced. w/e.
 

belfast_sl

shitlord
65
0
Yes, you can kill the people burning down the forest. Does it respawn instantly? Are you protecting the forest for a reason? Are you protecting every forest in the game world because people are destroying them for no reason? All of your solutions are aimed at normal people, not Trolls. Does the game know you are Trolling and it keeps you from respawning once killed? Does burning down forests give you a respawn timer increase, or flag you as a Troll? Does accidentally burning down a forest flag you as a Troll regardless, or flag you for PVP regardless, or give you faction hits regardless? What about NPCs? What if someone trains a mob that shoots fireballs around through forests intentionally? What if this happens when you are asleep? What if...

No, you haven't thought it through, and you are putting way too much freedom in the hands of a populace that -will- do all of the above, especially in a F2P game. It isn't remedial to apply common sense to a no-brainer issue when dealing with human nature. Especially online human nature. Take the worst, then aim for the best. But you -have- to take the worst into account.
If all the forests are burned day 1, so be it. I'm sure if the tools are available, players that want forests will grow/protect them and in the process corner the market on whatever special wood they can harvest. How is this not promoting the emergent gameplay they/we want?
 

zzeris

King Turd of Shit Hill
<Gold Donor>
19,593
78,756
I would love to see forests burn down sometimes. Sure, I wouldn't want the whole forest to burn down but isn't that a realistic expectation? In dry weather trees burn down? I'd love to be camping an area of the forest and then see smoke rising up somewhere nearby. Imagine the extra gameplay elements that could be introduced. Fires hurt you, smoke inhalation if you stay in for so long, changed environments for a small time,etc. Done right, this can be very good. I don't expect it to happen in this game at all but it would be cool.
 

tad10

Elisha Dushku
5,518
583
The height of SOE's comeback came with Hartsman and the EQ2 EoF expansion. Why? Because the relic management was being dismembered.
Rift (Hatsmann) blew chunks and SoV (Butler/Trost) is considered one of the great EQ expansions. The reality is (and you sorta try to make this point) MMOs are so complex no developer gets them right on purpose. Early Vanilla WoW was very good because they just copied EQ and removed downtown, then of course Blizzard started stomping on emergent behavior. EQ was good in part because it was a new type of game and the devs didn't know exactly what they were doing, so player behaviors could become part of the game. As I've pointed out before, EQN maybe repeating this same scenario it's a new type of game and the devs don't know exactly what they're doing, so again player behaviors could become part of the game.

Everybody gets a second chance to screw up.

/FTP Aside.

I'm not the first to mention this but I'll repeat it. SOE needs PTP (Gold Level) servers where only cosmetic shop items are allowed and FTP servers where any shop items (xp pots, etc) are allowed. However, and I am repeating a friend's suggestion not my own, but I like it, the FTP servers should be "locked" by the PTP servers. Using a POP example: no guild on the FTP servers could enter the Plane of Time until on at least one Gold/PTP server guild has killed Quarm. Using a Rezz example, the giant snake raid mob would have to be spawned and killed on at least one PTP server before it could spawn on a FTP server.

Uberguilds will thus flock to PTP servers while more casual players will consolidate on FTP servers. Everybody's happy except for timmy who wants to pay for a spell that instagibs Quarm.
 

belfast_sl

shitlord
65
0
Believe it or not, some people want to murder/fight other people under the guise of being the "good guy." Some might take great pleasure in putting arsonists to sleep and making their lives horrible. Just because someone doesn't want to be the griefing dick that instigates trouble doesn't mean they don't love the conflict.
 

Itzena_sl

shitlord
4,609
6
The good news is after everything's burned down, they will have to look for something else to do.

Like make their own things, and they probably won't want to burn down their owns things. More likely, you will have groups building things together and wanting to burn down other people's things. That's when things get rolling.

Typically, the people dedicated enough to build things are also dedicated enough to organize and easily squash the horde of individuals (retards) trying to burn everything down.
Ahahahahahahaha.

Hahaha.


Ha.

Did you ever play EVE? Because youtotallysound like the sort of RP wanker who talks a big game approximately two days before Goonswarm burnt all their shit down to the foundations and then pissed on the ashes.
 

Utnayan

F16 patrolling Rajaah until he plays DS3
<Gold Donor>
16,437
12,386
My instinct is that you're wrong here Ut. As noted, I'd given up on SOE but now the tea leaves suggest some unholy combination of Storybricks, Sandboxiness, Jeff Butler and Pixie Dust has turned it around for EQN. We'll see in 7 days.
Unfortunately we all have 14 years of experience watching these people trail blaze from company to company fucking up whatever they touch. It's because of these folks, now all in one place again, that causes those SOE employee rants. From Rich Vogel and Gordon Walton from SOE to Bioware to now other companies, , to Brad McQuaid and Jeff Butler from SOE to Sigil, back to SOE, to the bullshit artists Bill Trost and Steve Danuser. All these people have a few things in common. 1) Their management style sucks. 2) They do not have the talent to do anything on their own. 3) When put together, it's enough falsely given ego centric SOE homegrown infalliable audacity to sink any project they work on. We have seen the failrues inside SOE, we have seen the same people fail outside SOE, and they have not learned or changed one damn bit in the process.

Until that changes, nothing will become of EQ Next. (And in all honesty, it doesn't change. It requires an entire reboot of fresh blood and an entirely different culture shift.) Sorry Tad, this company has reverted back to the same way that they were when Ester the Tester was telling everyone unfinished content was working as intended.

Everybody gets a second chance to screw up.
Yeah. They are on, collectively, 56. Why? Because no one held them accountable the first 55 times. It's fairly hard to learn from your mistakes when you have smoke blown up your ass that your mistakes were glorious financial successes just misunderstood by the gaming public by 56 politically correct morons all bucking for a promotion or afraid to get fired.
 

Soygen

The Dirty Dozen For the Price of One
<Nazi Janitors>
28,369
43,355
Well to be fair, the unfinished contentwasworking as intended. Unfinished and broken.