Health Care Thread

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Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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Under the ACA their profits are capped, you do realize, right?

If they earn over the profit limit they have limited choices: refunds or tossing money into the subsidy fund.

Without that law, sure they'd do elsewise but subsidy funding will cost them less in manhours to administer, so should be more frequent although being new this year - refunds were the only option last year. So there's no historic precedent yet.
 

Famm

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
11,041
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I said it's good that they're gone and that we should look to removing other totalitarian regimes, which you disagreed with, so of course I'm going to think you support them because you don't want them gone.
If you don't want to invade NK you obviously support them!!!
 

Adebisi

Clump of Cells
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You guys think that regimes that believe only one book needs to be taught in schools, that human ownership and mutilation is cool, and that ethnic and religious cleansing is fine, and Jihad against all Westerners is well-deserved. In fact, it seems you support it as if they were rational secular states.
no, you guys are right.

Pakistani teen shot for backing girls??T education awarded EU human rights prize ??" but failed to capture the Nobel Peace Prize?* - NY Daily News
She deserved it.
Prevalence of female genital mutilation by country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Women need to know their place.
Apostasy in Islam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
History of Jihad against the Americans (2001 - ongoing)
Christians Facing Genocide in Muslim World :: The Investigative Project on Terrorism
Sharia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I could go on but there's no possible argument that would get you to change your minds or even get you to think about what you're saying.
If only we ignore brutal dictators and countries that believe in horrible, horrible things, they'll go away.

I'm done with y'all. The fact that you actually support these countries, and think we can coexist with them when they flat out tell us they want us dead for the singular reason we don't agree with them, amazes me. You should move there. You'd like it.
Straw-man3.jpg


Holy shit you've lost your fucking mind.
 

TheBeagle

JunkiesNetwork Donor
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Do you even English? How is that contradictory? There are other ways to remove a regime than militarily attacking it.
Ok, so if you're gonna double down on this stupidity then please give us a few examples of an American President not named Barak Hussein Obamba in the last one hundred years that removed an evil regime from power without military action.

You must really, really, really hate this country if your opinion of anyone that isn't ready to commit US soldiers and treasure to remove every tin-pot dictator in the world is that they are some sort of coward that hates freedom. Guess what, an overwhelming majority of Americans are sick and fucking tired of these overseas adventures and tired of people like you always looking for a new reason to stick our American noses where they don't belong. How can you stand to live in a country in which you have such a seething hatred for +80% of its population? Perhaps you would be better off living somewhere else.
 

Loser Araysar

Chief Russia Reporter. Stock Pals CEO. Head of AI.
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Isn't Saudi Arabia far more theocratic and is even a monarchy, so arguably more fascist as well, compared to Iraq's old regime?
A lot of people think that the defining characteristic of fascism is repression, but its not. Repression is endemic to many ideologies. What really sets fascism apart from others is imperialism, corporatism and nationalism. In other words, there isnt a single country in Middle East to whom this is applicable.

Which is why the term "islamo-fascism" is total nonsense. It's like conservatives try smash together 2 things that they know everyone else hates in hopes of that no one will think too hard about the absurdity of combining these two. You know, kinda like when they call Obama an atheist commie muslim
 

frqkjt_sl

shitlord
199
0
Under the ACA their profits are capped, you do realize, right?
If they earn over the profit limit they have limited choices: refunds or tossing money into the subsidy fund.
Without that law, sure they'd do elsewise but subsidy funding will cost them less in manhours to administer, so should be more frequent although being new this year - refunds were the only option last year. So there's no historic precedent yet.
Profits are capped by the 80/20 rule. Their profits are guaranteed is my point (i.e. their profits will not be lower than pre-ACA, by provisions in the ACA), hence it doesn't make any sense to say they're paying subsidies. At best, they'd be taking more then paying the extra out (this turns out to not be the case).

How The Affordable Care Act Pays For Insurance Subsidies : Shots - Health News : NPR

Dentist Aaron McLemore ... makes more than $100,000 a year ...A new policy from the exchange will more than double his monthly premium and nearly double his yearly out-of-pocket maximum.His higher costs aren't subsidizing lower-income policyholders, whose subsidy has already been paid by the government. But he is providing a subsidy in another way: The Affordable Care Act requires him to buy a policy with features he doesn't need.
In other words, the insurance co is not taking extra money from Dentist Aaron and giving it to sick, poor man Bob. The insurance co is keeping extra from Aaron to compensate for poor man Bob's premium payments not covering the cost of Bob's healthcare. If the extra premium money from people like Dentist Aaron isn't enough to compensate for all of the poor Bobs, and the insurance co's might see lower profits, the ACA lets them raise premiums, further putting the screws to Dentist Aaron, who is a business owner and employer.

Dentist Aaron is not a rich man - his yearly income ought to be just enough to support a family of 4 in traditional American middle class lifestyle formerly enjoyed by union factory workers in the 80's.
So if you're a low-income person getting a tax credit from the U.S. Treasury to subsidize your health care, a big chunk of that credit is coming from taxes paid by the well-off. ... "Those families with incomes above $250,000 a year will now have to pay more in Medicare payroll taxes."
about half the costs are offset by projected savings in Medicare payments to insurers and hospitals. Another quarter is offset by added taxes on medical-device makers and drug companies.
So, who is the government getting money from to pay the subsidies then?
Looks to me like sucessful business owners/entrepreneurs get fucked. Maybe a guy is comfortable with $250k earnings, but also he is likely an employer. I wonder, that $250k is the owner's take home income after paying all business expenses, including payroll (and soon healthcare for employees), or do the business expense deductions run out short of that point, meaning the owner gets taxed on income he doesn't get to keep as it must be spent on overhead. Even in the best case scenario, it's still money that could have been reinvested in the business.

Is this extra tax progressive so that the parasite Wall St. CEO getting huge bonuses out of tax payer bailouts pays higher tax than the business owner/employer earning $250k? I doubt it.
 

Loser Araysar

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I equate fascism to totalitarianism and general despotic rule. Seemingly quite wrongly.
You can equate just about any government ideology to totalitarianism and general despotic rule if you look hard enough. It's a benchmark that is so broad as to be almost meaningless because abuse of power and despotism is not exclusive to one particular ideology
 

Disp_sl

shitlord
1,544
1
So, who is the government getting money from to pay the subsidies then?
Looks to me like sucessful business owners/entrepreneurs get fucked. Maybe a guy is comfortable with $250k earnings, but also he is likely an employer. I wonder, that $250k is the owner's take home income after paying all business expenses, including payroll (and soon healthcare for employees), or do the business expense deductions run out short of that point, meaning the owner gets taxed on income he doesn't get to keep as it must be spent on overhead. Even in the best case scenario, it's still money that could have been reinvested in the business.

Is this extra tax progressive so that the parasite Wall St. CEO getting huge bonuses out of tax payer bailouts pays higher tax than the business owner/employer earning $250k? I doubt it.
Businesses get up to 50% tax credits on their group plans now, big guy. I enrolled a group a month ago that is providing a similar plan as last year and will be saving over $10,000/yr. compared to their 2013 plan. Needless to say they were just as upset as the successful self employed people I've enrolled in individual plans who have massive tax write offs, bringing their modified adjusted gross income down substantially, and qualifying them for large subsidies. Those successful businesses were absolutely furious having to pay less and get better coverage than last year.

Here's a snapshot of some of the successful entrepreneurs I've enrolled and the annual subsidy they're receiving. They are:
1) Geological engineer business owner
2) Tile laying contractor
3) Owns a nursing and CPR training school
4) General contractor
5) Furniture and antique shop owner
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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Frk: Average insurance company was over 30% profit pre-ACA, with 40-45% not being a rarity. I've got stockholder reports for the three I carry over 10k shares of each that list out net profit each year going for around 15 years, since they're an investment I never adjusted from my inheritance.

Just flipping through them I see the lowest as 12% in one singular case, and two others under 20% - out of what must be 40 reports.

Additionally note in addition to profits, administrative costs have legal limits now too.

And technically the NPR quote is accurate, the insurance companies have to hand the money to the Fed they don't handle tracking tax records for subsidy qualification after all, most places phrase it as "extra taxes on insurance companies that go over the profit margin cap" which goes into the same pot as the FICA portion.

Frankly it's similar to how Medicare is funded, nothing from the general budget. Specific earmarked portion from FICA and premiums plus cost sharing from clients. (Except the insurance companies excess profits replace the latter) Truthfully speaking Medicare is paid for by the Fed, but entirely by specialized taxes that don't effect the general budget - subsidies work the same way. Without a law change or a FICA change (which would require a law change) it won't effect tax rates a dime because it CAN'T, unless you're a overly profitable insurance company.

OR for a silly analogy...

Boy Scout Troop leader collects $5 each from his troop and runs out to buy them 30 pizzas with the money. You could say the kids or he is paying for it, and both are accurate. I'd say it's most accurate to say the kids are (or their parents likely more accurately) since saying the troop leader paid for it doesn't give any indication of the money's source, thus implying it's from the troop leader's standard forms of income.
 

Hoss

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Just to be clear, nobody is pretending the whole thing wasn't about oil, right?
If iraq was about oil, where's the oil? Or did we lose that one?

Saddam didn't tolerate religious fervor and asked complete obedience to his party.
True dat. I work with a guy who grew up in saddam's iraq as a catholic. He has a very high opinion of saddam. He says he always supported the church and sent gifts on the holy days and crap like that.
 

Hoss

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I equate fascism to totalitarianism and general despotic rule. Seemingly quite wrongly.
I equate facism with douchebags, because it's pretty much always a douchebag going on about facism.
 

Vaclav

Bronze Baronet of the Realm
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How else? In the beginning, even when you called, the navigators had to use the website. Did that change?
Was never true - they were trained to use that method FIRST however if it was available because it's the fastest.