Marriage and the Power of Divorce

BrotherWu_sl said:

What are lacey boy cut panties?

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Like this.

And no I'm not posting myself in underwear.

Be that way,man

a_skeleton_03_sl said:

This is what i absolutely hate about that whole thing. If you were a woman it would be "your body, your choice" and nobody would question you or they would be risking a lawsuit.

Go in as a man and you need written consent from your wife for a vasectomy, or you are too young, or you don't have enough kids. Absolute bullshit. Women would be marching in the streets if they were treated like that, I am looking at you Mist.

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Not even close to true. Whether it's an abortion or tubal ligation (and depending on the place/age), they're given all kinds of hurdles. Plenty of them get rejected for the same kinds of reasons (too young, might want to have kids). I'm not sure if you're joking, ranting, or just naive.

BrotherWu_sl said:

Lindz,

Regarding the big V, my wife can't take birth control but I'm in the same camp as your husband: Really don't want more kids but really really don't want a knife in my balls. It's not only that but there is something about the concept of shooting blanks that just seems emasculated to me. I've been criticized for it here before and I recognize it for what it is- a hang up.

Nevertheless, based on Blazin's experience, I think it is even less likely I'll ever do it.

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What do you guys use? Barrier is not an option. He is about as keen on condoms as he is on vasectomies. We've used them maybe a handful of times and complained every time.

I've been thinking of talking to my doctor about other hormonal alternatives since what seems to be the problem for me is the drop in estrogen during the off week of the pill. We've talked about doing three months where I skip the off week and skip my period to avoid it, but that still means migraines every three months and they'll likely be worse. I'm wondering if an IUD, depo-provera or implant might work better just for more regular dose or hormones.

Don't they have a patch now too? Maybe it works differently.

IUD's come with risks the same as Vasectomies. I've heard some absolute horror stories about those. Including an ex-gf of mine's sister almost dying as it fused to her cervix or some crazy shit.

NoodleAnus_sl said:

We've had so much trouble that I'm not even thinking about it yet, but the snip snip is concerning to me. I feel like I'm the dude they'd mess up on and I'd wake up with balls where my penis goes and a penis where my balls go.

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They don't knock you out. And the anesthetic can wear off. And who ever tells you it is a little tug and a little snip IS A HUGE FUCKING LIAR!

a_skeleton_03_sl said:

Did I say it was a legal requirement? Many doctors still do this because it is an elective procedure.

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No, but you made it sound like women don't get any pushback, anywhere, and only men do, which is not accurate ("If you were a woman it would be "your body, your choice" and nobody would question you or they would be risking a lawsuit."). They both get resistance.

You apparently have a special case with the military but that only affects a fairly small portion of men. Do military women have to get consent from their husbands for tubal ligations?

Edit: Reading up on it more, it seems a woman does indeed need her husband's permission to get her tubes tied. So, your venting is misplaced somewhat. Women get it no easier than you.

The Master_sl said:

I actually know a girl who is 25 who has been trying to get a tubal ligation for two years. She has been to a little over three dozen surgeons and none of them will do it. Nothing illegal about it, they can decline to do any elective surgery they want. And she always gets told "You might want kids some day!"

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My wife had hers at 25, but the doctor basically pushed that because she had severe complications and came close to some bad business. For her and my youngest daughter. Of course she regrets it now because women have the memory of a goldfish and she forgot the time she almost fucking died. I guess I am here to remind her.

If she hadn't, I was absolutely going to get a vasectomy. Not getting one doesn't make sense to me in the grand scheme of things.

a_skeleton_03_sl said:

Nobody needs any permission by state or federal mandate so not seeing that about tubal ligation. Citation please.

I have a wife that actually delivers babies and they will tie tubes right on the spot no questions asked with no consent from the husband and are not allowed to talk about it to the husband. Yeah don't feed me the crap that women have it just as hard.

Planned Parenthood of Central Missouri v. Danforth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Planned Parenthood v. Casey - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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I think you're misreading what I was saying (and I wasn't perfectly clear in what I meant) -- my edit in the previous post was in reference to women in the military. No civilian is required to legally get permission, male or female. I never argued otherwise. In the military, both male and female need permission of their spouse. So, it's equal there and that's the specific thing you were complaining about.

Also, are you really going to use experience of one person, your wife, to declare how the entire country treats women who want their tubes tied? I think I read elsewhere that you're in San Diego? If so, that matters a lot. There are plenty of women who complain about doctors refusing women the procedure (which, yes, they're allowed to do) and a lot of that stems from where they're located.

Also, yes, you're quoting some abortion cases where some victory was achieved, but there are still things like mandatory ultrasounds, mandatory waiting periods, mandatory counseling, etc (not to mention all the tricks and regulations that made the number of abortion providers decrease significantly in certain areas). You can't go into every abortion provider and get one on the spot.

lindz_sl said:

What do you guys use? Barrier is not an option. He is about as keen on condoms as he is on vasectomies. We've used them maybe a handful of times and complained every time.

I've been thinking of talking to my doctor about other hormonal alternatives since what seems to be the problem for me is the drop in estrogen during the off week of the pill. We've talked about doing three months where I skip the off week and skip my period to avoid it, but that still means migraines every three months and they'll likely be worse. I'm wondering if an IUD, depo-provera or implant might work better just for more regular dose or hormones.

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Wife had IUD twice and it does work but there were hormonal changes that she didn't like and eventually decided she didn't want it anymore. I've heard both sides of the fence with those (good and bad) from others. The few people I know who's gotten 'the shot' have all had horror stories. I don't like condoms either, but it's a necessary evil these days.

a_skeleton_03_sl said:

I thank you for probably being infinitely more sane with your reply than I might have with mine.

I also had mentioned my civilian doctor wanting "permission" from my wife as well so therefore the confusion.

Yes we are in San Diego and that does matter a lot. You list all the mandatory things slowing an abortion down. That doesn't apply to all states just so you know. That still doesn't change the fact that a man has no right to question what a woman does to her body and as a result their baby. Regardless if it is his baby as well. That is my entire point about the hypocrisy of doctors asking consent from a wife for a vasectomy but being hands off for anything to do with a woman's body. This isn't about abortion or birth control and whether they are right, wrong, or whatever. This is about a woman's rights in the medical field are holy and sacrosanct for some reason and a man's rights can be stepped all over with zero thought.

I feel like this has a large role in it.Report Highlights Huge Gender Disparity in Healthcare Leadership | TechCrunch

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Thanks; not everything has to devolve into a flame war (even on Rerolled).

I know those rules don't apply to all states, but there are many obstacles in many states. Likewise, there are many doctors who will refuse a woman getting her tubes tied if she hasn't had kids or is young (likewise with men). I imagine the places it's easier to get an abortion or tubal ligation, it's also easier to get a vasectomy. I don't really have any hard data (though I haven't researched) on refusals to do these procedures, though, just anecdotal reports (like yours).

the hypocrisy of doctors asking consent from a wife for a vasectomy but being hands off for anything to do with a woman's body

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I'm a little confused why this is still perturbing you. In the military it's the same. For civilian life, it's the same legally. I understand you have a negative experience with a civilian doctor wanting permission, but I could provide links to women saying the same thing. It seems like women's and men's rights are pretty similar when it comes to undergoing surgeries to prevent future pregnancies.

However, as to the topic of a woman having the ultimate control over what happens to the baby... what would you propose? There's only two people involved. If you let the man have veto power, then he effectively has total control. There's really no way to take or split responsibility -- you as a man can't carry all/half the baby, or carry the baby for 9/4.5 months. Many of our laws are about freedom and it seems pretty consistent to allow a person control over their own body. It's only in extreme circumstances that another person can take authority over another person's body (incarceration, for example, though even then they have many legal rights regarding their body). And I don't think a pregnancy court would be a good situation for anyone.

Would you want some other person to say you must do something for nine months against your will? You might say it's then the woman's responsibility to avoid sex if she doesn't want to give up control of her body, but an easy retort to that is that a man shouldn't have sex if he doesn't want to lose control of what becomes of his sperm. I do think it's imperfect because of the biological realities but I think we should err on the side of a person having control of their body except in extreme circumstances (based on your posts, I don't think you be too fond of, for example, your wife being able to *force* you to have a vascetomy). Maybe you think pregnancy is an extreme circumstance and I guess we would just have to differ there.