Marriage and the Power of Divorce

Frenzied Wombat · Oct 20, 2014

Ameraves_sl said:
I think you may be correct. However, this goes waaaay back to even when we were first dating and engaged. She never argues back, ever. And I can guarantee you 100% I was not right every time we got into an argument, as much as I would have liked to believe I was at the time.

I believe you because typically a man being right has little to do with a woman's ability and/or desire to have an argument. In fact, in my experience it is when you ARE right that the claws come out and the crazy explodes, because "crazy" counters logic/righteousness by deflecting the source of the grievance into a "what the fuck are you talking about-- that has nothing to do with X?!" scenario. If she's taken a passive stance in regards to arguments since the start, consider yourself a lucky man.

I wish I had some better advice for you. Her "issue" concerns a matter entirely out of your control, which is probably the source of her current moral conflict. I don't mean to pry, but how much of her angst do you think is sexually related?

Tenks · Oct 20, 2014

Khane_sl said:
Except concerning matters of raw denim

Those are matters of fact generally. Usually in relationships you don't have a heated argument about something that can be proven. Like if my wife tells me something that is factually false I'll correct her but I won't have a long argument over something that is a matter of opinion.

Frenzied Wombat · Oct 20, 2014

Tenks_sl said:
Those are matters of fact generally. Usually in relationships you don't have a heated argument about something that can be proven. Like if my wife tells me something that is factually false I'll correct her but I won't have a long argument over something that is a matter of opinion.

If you don't argue, does that stop the discussion? In my experience, if you don't argue back you get to hear it anyways unless you leave the house.

lindz · Oct 20, 2014

Ameraves_sl said:
As soon as she said something to me about how she was feeling, I insisted we go to a counselor. The counselor basically sat there and quickly realized there wasn't much she could do. She essentially said that my wife either needed to find a way to deal with my limitations, and therefore her not being able to enjoy some things normal couples can do, or we would have to split up. There is literally nothing that I can change that will fix the way my wife feels. She wants some basic things like being able to go for a hike together, take a walk and hold hands, and have a normal sex life. The counselor did encourage my wife to go get some individual counseling though, which I have encouraged her to do for a long time. She is terrible with speaking about her emotions and just holds everything in. So I am trying to get her to do that as well, but I don't want to be too pushy.

Now, to further complicate things. My wife is currently 6 months pregnant...with another couples child. Yes, my wife who is a stay at home mother to our 3 little ones is also being a surrogate for some very good friends of ours. She agreed to do it for a few reasons. First and most importantly is because of how much she loves our kids, and the thought of being able to help another couple have that same experience was something she couldn't say no to. Second was because her two pregnancies were so easy she didn't think too much about it. Of course this pregnancy has been very difficult for her so far, so it is adding more strain.

I think she should definitely see someone alone. It seems like there are more than just marriage problems here and she could really get a lot of help from someone supporting her. It can take awhile to find the right person. so don't get discouraged if the one time you guys went it wasn't right.

And yeah, pregnancy is not the time to be making life altering decisions. Work on encouraging her to seek help.

The Master · Oct 20, 2014

Frenzied Wombat_sl said:
If you don't argue, does that stop the discussion? In my experience, if you don't argue back you get to hear it anyways unless you leave the house.

You don't always have to agree on everything. That is a mistake a lot of couples make. Sometimes something is a matter of opinion, specifically a rationally indeterminate opinion, and you're just not going to agree. So you agree to disagree and move on with all the actual important things. I've never been with a girl who doesn't agree with this philosophy, but based on stories in this thread I've never dated a girl anywhere near as crazy as you guys do. So take that with a grain of salt.

Frenzied Wombat · Oct 20, 2014

The Master_sl said:
You don't always have to agree on everything. That is a mistake a lot of couples make. Sometimes something is a matter of opinion, specifically a rationally indeterminate opinion, and you're just not going to agree. So you agree to disagree and move on with all the actual important things. I've never been with a girl who doesn't agree with this philosophy, but based on stories in this thread I've never dated a girl anywhere near as crazy as you guys do. So take that with a grain of salt.

Oh absolutely, I agree. In fact most things aren't worth arguing about, especially concerning subjective topics. It's just that sometimes if you don't argue back they seem to think you "don't care", and/or it just turns into a lecture. I'll usually avoid arguments as much as I can, because I just don't have the emotional fortitude to deal with it. An argument for me is mentally draining/upsetting, but chicks seem to be far more resilient to these factors.

etoille · Oct 21, 2014

Frenzied Wombat_sl said:
Take this for what it's worth, but when it's the woman just sitting there not saying anything while you do the arguing, she's either already checked out, or realizes that anything she wants to say will make herself feel more guilty. In my experience the only time women are silent in an argument is when they know they are dead wrong (in a "I'm guilty" sense) or don't care. My guess is from an ethical/morality standpoint she knows you're right, and her desire to leave the relationship is predicated on selfish, though understandable, reasons. She's struggling because you're not a lying, cheating, "bad dad" asshole --typical reasons for a justified break-up.She wants to possibly leave because she's having an early mid-life crisis where she sees herself with a bunch of kids, pregnant, and has a husband with a disability.Since she sounds like a good person at heart, this is a morality crisis for her.

This is kind of what I was driving towards. (underlined).

In re the sitting there not saying nothing - for me it's not the dead wrong thing. I'm in the if I'm wrong I'll apologize camp. I hate people who don't do that so I make it a point to do it. Why keep arguing if you know you're wrong - admit you fucked up, move on.

So you're 100 percent correct on the 'don't care' or checked out part of me. When I stop arguing with you it's usually because we've had this argument before, it's not going to change, I don't care not only about the issue but the relationship as well enough to spend my time getting emotional about it whatsoever. It rarely happens (has never happened with my husband) but in other relationships (even outside dating etc - ie with family, friends) it's usually a deathknell for the relationship. Because I don't give enough of a fuck anymore to even work on fixing it with you and I've stopped caring about whether or not it will click for you. I'm just done. So waiting for you to stop talking so I can move on - 99% percent of the time not only from the topic, but from you, for good.

Noodleface · Oct 21, 2014

Once had a girlfriend break up with me because we never argued, and most couples argue so clearly something was wrong. I didn't argue when she wanted to break up so she thought I didn't want to fight for her.

Women are cray

ZyyzYzzy · Oct 21, 2014

Hi Etoille, I thought I felt the ground shake.

Khane · Oct 21, 2014

Noodleface_sl said:
I didn't argue when she wanted to break up so she thought I didn't want to fight for her.

Well, on this front she had a point. If you don't argue when someone says "I think we should break up" it means you agree.

Kirun · Oct 21, 2014

ZyyzYzzy_sl said:
Hi Etoille, I thought I felt the ground shake.

I wish I could net you.

Tenks · Oct 21, 2014

Noodleface_sl said:
Once had a girlfriend break up with me because we never argued, and most couples argue so clearly something was wrong. I didn't argue when she wanted to break up so she thought I didn't want to fight for her.

Women are cray

I had a similar thing but I feel that is just the canned reason the girl will give for breaking up. Ultimately it is a lack of passion which she is lacking. But this girl was from a pretty not-so-great household past so maybe she honestly thought that all relationships involve a heavy amount of agruing.

Noodleface · Oct 21, 2014

Khane_sl said:
Well, on this front she had a point. If you don't argue when someone says "I think we should break up" it means you agree.

True but I felt like she was breaking up just so we could have an argument or something. I wasn't really down with that and while I miss the pussy I don't miss the bitch.

The Ancient_sl · Oct 21, 2014

lindz_sl said:
And yeah, pregnancy is not the time to be making life altering decisions. Work on encouraging her to seek help.

This is pretty much all that needs to be said.

j00t · Oct 21, 2014

This may or may not be the issue, or even AN issue, but there are certain personality types that are terrified of conflict and will avoid it at all costs, even if that means conceding their point as they perceive it will end the conflict. Except it doesn't. It just builds up over time until they get to the point where avoiding the conflict means breaking up. You just need to get her to feel at ease and comfortable enough for her to face that conflict.

Soygen · Oct 21, 2014

My girlfriend never argues with me. I just attribute that to my 100% being-right-in-all-things.

Khane · Oct 21, 2014

Or you're just a beta bucks sucker and she's gettin the real D on the side from an ex NFL player. He's also African American. Live with that.

Soygen · Oct 21, 2014

Touche. It's 50/50 at this point.

The Ancient_sl · Oct 21, 2014

Soygen_sl said:
My girlfriend never argues with me. I just attribute that to my 100% being-right-in-all-things.

I attribute it to the fact that hands have no cognizance or vocal chords.

Soygen · Oct 21, 2014

Don't be jelly. Getting my girl manicured after work today.

Marriage and the Power of Divorce

Potato del Grande

Bronze Knight of the Realm

Potato del Grande

#DDs

Bronze Squire

Potato del Grande

A Mod Real Quick

RIP USA

Got something right about marriage

Buzzfeed Editor

Bronze Knight of the Realm

A Mod Real Quick

shitlord

Silver Baronet of the Realm

The Dirty Dozen For the Price of One

Got something right about marriage

The Dirty Dozen For the Price of One

shitlord

The Dirty Dozen For the Price of One