Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

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Vandyn

Blackwing Lair Raider
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Another thought on instancing, there are times when that is the preferable way to go, specifically when trying to tell a story. Perfect example of this is Nek Castle in EQ2. This is a great zone and one that could only be accomplished being instanced, due to the way the zone is laid out, scripting, etc.
 

Wystler_sl

shitlord
47
0
Yeah, it'll be difficult recreating the the bard class. It's really one of a kind and I just don't see another game allowing so many broken abilities to be combined with such mediocre ones!
Just to be clear, Bards were badass motherfuckers and no one should talk smack about them. I'm pretty sure no other class could kill 40 mobs at once.
Tuco's not wrong, that's what made the Bards so much fun in my opinion; stupid bard tricks. There were a lot of meh bards around and most people didn't know what a good one was until they grouped with one. I hated kiting. Spent maybe a few hours total in all the years I played EQ doing it to try to see what all the fuss was about. Good XP sure, but boring as hell. I got thousands of AA's with guildies grouped. Didn't need to swarm or AE.

On the darkness, yes please. Just make sure there's a way for a smaller light source in every starting area and the way towards that source is lit at least well enough to stumble towards it. We figured it out just fine then and gamers are a lot more savvy these days.
 

Utnayan

F16 patrolling Rajaah until he plays DS3
<Gold Donor>
16,525
12,565
^^ It (lighting) was nice because it was balanced. The advantage of seeing in the night with Ultravision also made you KOS pretty much anywhere you went. It was a nice trade off and added that same feeling none of us get anymore because there aren't any more MMORPG's with rich choice consequences. I would say design that in the same way EQ was designed and balance it with factions.
 

Quineloe

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
6,978
4,464
From what you've seen so far... is he wrong?
So what? It's not like he's saying something we didn't know before he said it. Hey, the sky is blue! and when it's cloudy, it's not!

I am going to keep posting about my thoughts on the Kickstarter and Brad McQuaid and the likelihood of the success of the project even if it is funded. Brad has some decent ideas when it comes to making games. If this is funded I think now the question would be who the hell is going to manage him, because no matter what he has learned; he isn't a business man, lets his personal feelings cloud hiring decisions, and loses focus quickly. And this was with tens of millions of dollars coming from Microsoft. This hasn't changed. He's a game designer, not a C-Level executive. He's out of his league running a company.
and you never did anything wrong in your entire life. I hope your shittiest little mistake comes back and haunts you when you least need it, because you are truly one unbearable shitbag when it comes to bringing up the past
 

Wystler_sl

shitlord
47
0
The KS charts look clearer for sure, much better.

But, I do not see a fix for someone that wants to be in the Dev guild AND wants to pre-test. ($500 plus package)

Not sure if that will ever change at this point, but it still seems to put the $500 peeps on the fence whether to lower pledge.
I think it's there. From what I'm reading they're calling that early testing, "testing access" now and it's in both $500 and $600. Should be all good now. Might be mistaken but that's how I'm reading it.
 

Vandyn

Blackwing Lair Raider
3,656
1,382
So what? It's not like he's saying something we didn't know before he said it. Hey, the sky is blue! and when it's cloudy, it's not!



and you never did anything wrong in your entire life. I hope your shittiest little mistake comes back and haunts you when you least need it, because you are truly one unbearable shitbag when it comes to bringing up the past
The question continues to remain, he was in charge of this type of project before, with more favorable circumstances (money). Yet we saw with our own eyes how it failed miserably. What gives confidence that it will succeed this time? You can make the argument that EQ itself would not have become popular with SOE getting involved. Who's getting involved now?
 

Jimbolini

Semi-pro Monopoly player
2,592
970
I think it's there. From what I'm reading they're calling that early testing, "testing access" now and it's in both $500 and $600. Should be all good now. Might be mistaken but that's how I'm reading it.
Yea..saw that on the new chart..but not changed on old descriptions. I assume they cannot change the old ones.
 

Merlin_sl

shitlord
2,329
1
The question continues to remain, he was in charge of this type of project before, with more favorable circumstances (money). Yet we saw with our own eyes how it failed miserably. What gives confidence that it will succeed this time? You can make the argument that EQ itself would not have become popular with SOE getting involved. Who's getting involved now?
And you continue to ask it. Yea, we get it.
 

Jimbolini

Semi-pro Monopoly player
2,592
970
There are still a couple hours to finish off the official first "week" ... I would say it will close out around 182k. Things could have been much worse, and it seems each day brings a few fixes... but by this time next week we will know for sure I think.
 

Big Flex

Fitness Fascist
4,314
3,166
What you say is exactly what's needed but too bad most Game Designers focus on "story" and "quests" in MMORPGs when all we need is something like you describe to enjoy the game where WE create our own stories, adventures and quests.
thats exactly my point regarding contested and noninstanced content as well. running from qeynos to Hph only to find the gnoll camp your group wanted taken, forcing you to find someplace else.. beholders maze or something unexpected, the journey there, and what you find spending time there IS the story I want to experience. not some presentation a dev came up with with pve speedbumps along the way.
 

Big Flex

Fitness Fascist
4,314
3,166
Yes! And I like how you describe storyline and quests to be artifical interests. Also probably explains why I (and many others) can't be bothered with them: I'll create my own tales, thank you. Like when I was in East Karana and panicked when I was jumped by an undead Gnoll with my druid, ending up snaring myself while attempting to heal the Gnoll.
smile.png


Nowadays you can't even snare yourself anymore, you will most likely get "That spell can not take hold on your current target".
exactly.
 

Quineloe

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
6,978
4,464
The question continues to remain, he was in charge of this type of project before, with more favorable circumstances (money). Yet we saw with our own eyes how it failed miserably. What gives confidence that it will succeed this time? You can make the argument that EQ itself would not have become popular with SOE getting involved. Who's getting involved now?
Nothing gives that confidence. As repeatedly pointed out now, this is our only chance, no matter how slim it is, to get another game like EQ because no other designers seem to be interested in making one and no corporation is interested in funding one. We're well aware the money we use to back this up might either never leave our accounts because the funding goal isn't met or might be gone forever with no game being delivered. It's a risk we're willing to take, and being talked down upon like a bunch of bored housewives who are about to gamble their kids college money away at Wall Street because they read a stupid housewife magazine with sekrit wall street tips in their boredom by Utnayan is disparaging and extremely unwelcome. And that is basically the only thing he contributed to the entire thread, all his nearly 80 posts are the same thing. We have plenty of discussions about actual design features going, none of which interest him in the least. This thread, to him, is all about slandering Aradune.

I'm fairly sure everyone who pledged is willing to let Vanguard slide for various reasons. For myself, it's the fact that he's 1-1 with EQ on his track record, something completely ignored by all the Vanguard haters, to them Brad is only the guy who ruined Vanguard, not the guy who created the entire genre in the first place. It's the fact that if he fails with this, his career as a professional game designer is over for good, no one will ever touch him again because his name will stain any product. Basically the position Utnayan wants to see him at today already.

This board, through the last decade, always went through two stages.
Either no dev was posting here, and everyone complained about that, with most understanding that it's these hate posters that kept them away, or a dev is posting here, and the hate posters can shit up the threads pretty much unchecked.
 

Muligan

Trakanon Raider
3,231
901
It's not a slippery slope with us. I hate a lot of instancing, I don't care for games that have a lot of instancing. I've rarely seen it done right, but when it is done right (sparingly) it can be a really cool way to tell a story. I'm talking 90/10 here, or maybe even 95/5.
You are a beautiful human being for this statement.
 

Muligan

Trakanon Raider
3,231
901
Will think on it. Maybe it's on a zone-by-zone basis.

btw, Vu just emailed me the zones he did in EQ 1 & 2 so i thought I'd share them:

EQ original: Kerra Isle, Rivervale, Grobb, Kaladim, Unrest and Felwithe
Kunark: Sebilis, Chardok, Charasis( Howling Stones) and City of Mist
Velious: Kael Drakkel and Temple of Veeshan
Luclin: Shar Vahl, Paludal Caverns, and Fungus Grove
Planes of Power: Plane of Knowledge, Plane of Torment and Solusek Ro's Tower

EQ2: Enchanted Lands, Rivervale, Orcishwastes, Lavastorm and Soluseks's Eye
Desert of Flames: Sinking Sands
Echos of Faydwer: Butcherblock mountains, Steamfont Mountains.
Rise of Kunark: Kylong Plains
He really did the majority of my favorite zones. Unrest? Wow. Sebilis? Wow. Paludal. Wow.... Even the EQ2 zones were good ones. This is something worth touting. It may not mean much to some of the new gamers but us old folks this is the type of guy you want to see as part of the team.
 

Cathex_sl

shitlord
93
0
He really did the majority of my favorite zones. Unrest? Wow. Sebilis? Wow. Paludal. Wow.... Even the EQ2 zones were good ones. This is something worth touting. It may not mean much to some of the new gamers but us old folks this is the type of guy you want to see as part of the team.
That's a legit resume. Some of my favorite zones for sure!
 

jilena_sl

shitlord
123
0
I guess i could live with true darkness if the nights generally are shorter than the days.... make it like 70/30 day/night cycle...a acceptable compromise for me.
I'd also just prefer if the nights were REALISTICALLY dark. Like if you're in a giant dense forest, it's probably almost pitch black. If you're in the middle of a wide open plain, most people can see a bit by moonlight/starlight. Obviously not daytime vision but it's not like OMG ENDLESS DARKNESS either. Be interesting to alter night with phases of the moon and the weather. Rainy night = cloudy = pitch black. Clear night + full moon = not so dark. (obv this is probably unnecessary for a game of this scope but it sounded cool lol)
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,767
617
I am going to keep posting about my thoughts on the Kickstarter and Brad McQuaid and the likelihood of the success of the project even if it is funded. Brad has some decent ideas when it comes to making games. If this is funded I think now the question would be who the hell is going to manage him, because no matter what he has learned; he isn't a business man, lets his personal feelings cloud hiring decisions, and loses focus quickly. And this was with tens of millions of dollars coming from Microsoft. This hasn't changed. He's a game designer, not a C-Level executive. He's out of his league running a company.
Since I'm the so called biggest fanboy to this game per some of the members, I'll say UT should have every right to post his opinions like all of us. Not that he needs anyone's ok.. Guy has been here longer then a lot of us.. He lost me with some of his claims but that doesn't mean he can't bring a lot of value and perspective to all this. Not even sure Brad would disagree there. I just hope you reign it in with the conspiracy stuff unless you can prove it. It really loses people. Ill even go on a limb and say you're somewhat hopeful and optimistic this can get done. That's why you're making the team suggestions.
 

Quineloe

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
6,978
4,464
He really did the majority of my favorite zones. Unrest? Wow. Sebilis? Wow. Paludal. Wow.... Even the EQ2 zones were good ones. This is something worth touting. It may not mean much to some of the new gamers but us old folks this is the type of guy you want to see as part of the team.
all 4 zones listed from Kunark are fucking gold. The prime of EQ dungeon design imo, Velious wasn't even close. Velketor's Labyrinth and Dragon Necropolis? Who went there :/