The Zionists are whining thread

Frenzied Wombat · Jul 16, 2014

fanaskin_sl said:
so all the citizens of gaza are under arrest now? that analogy is dumb.

lol no, but according to you they are.

Malakriss · Jul 16, 2014

You can't expect fana to remember every link he's edited in and out of all those posts.

fanaskin · Jul 16, 2014

why are you people so insanely dense, you can't leave, you're blocked and restricted in supply, it's practically an open air prison, which is decidedly different from a closed prison.

Open prison - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Frenzied Wombat_sl said:
lol no, but according to you they are.

I don't think they are charged but they live in effectivly similar conditions, so no I don't think everyone there is charged with crimes at all, and comparing it to a cell block prison is still dumb.

fanaskin · Jul 16, 2014

khalid_sl said:
Remember you linking this silly article?
Noam Chomsky: My Visit to Gaza, the World's Largest Open-Air Prison

the article is silly because none of those conditions, especially the ones highlighted exist or because you're hung up on a single word in the title?

Did you miss the part where they purposefully starved(but let in barely enough food for people to not die), who are surrounded with armed guards and can't leave. Did these things not occur in your mind?

Tuco · Jul 16, 2014

Come on Fanabro, you have to admit it's a little funny that you linked an article calling Gaza a prison then when someone mentions it being a prison you demand to know why they're being called prisoners.

fanaskin · Jul 16, 2014

ok I'm not in love with the title either.

I was more getting at, "what did they do(civilians) to deserve that luxury resort that is gaza?". If wombat committed a crime and was arrested and he had a choice of what facility to go to he'd pick the luxury of gaza to a huntsville penal facility.

ie wombat is implying all those people are worthy of prison like his fictional example and they should like their conditions or at least shouldn't complain, cause you know, they are all criminals.

those conditions are pretty bad if you ask me. that's the meat of it to me, what are the conditions for those people and what is israel's contributions to it, not some word in the title, Titles are attention grabbers usually. maybe the titles overzealous cause people get hung up on it, I don't really care either way. Like the zerohedge article wombat linked, it's the information that is more important.

Tuco · Jul 16, 2014

No, he's directly stating that calling it a prison is overreaching and you tripped over your rebuttal and are refusing to admit the humor in it.

fanaskin · Jul 16, 2014

Authors words not mine, some people they feel like it is because of the conditions there, it's not the largest stretch ever.

Tales from Gaza: What is life really like in 'the world's largest outdoor prison'?

Gaza is 'open-air prison' ? UN humanitarian chief

The United Nations under secretary general for Humanitarian Affairs and Emergency Relief Coordinator warned yesterday of an impending humanitarian disaster if Egypt succeeds in blocking the tunnels that pass under its border into the Gaza Strip. John Holmes said that as bad as the hundreds of tunnels that bypass the Israeli blockade are, Gaza would have difficult surviving if Egypt succeeds in blocking them because they are a conduit for badly-needed food, medicine and commercial goods.

"What people in Gaza want to see is the opening of the crossings ... not only for goods but for people because they are living ... in a large open-air prison," Mr Holmes said.

Australia MPs: Gaza is world's largest outdoor jail

An Australian politician ~ described Gaza as "the world's largest open-air prison camp"

Crossing the Border from Israel Into the Gaza Strip

It has been described as "the world's largest outdoor prison" as Israel limits access to medical cases and a few other exceptions, measures that Israel says are essential for its security.

Is the Gaza Strip "a quiet prison"?

Professor Ilan Pappa, Director of the European Centre for Palestine Studies at Exeter University

IP: "Well this time is not that different from the previous two attacks. All of the attacks sort of have a similar context with background changes from time to time. But the problem is the same problem. The problem is that Israel does not really know what to do with the Gaza Strip once it took the settlers out of there, trying to ghettoise it and hoping that this ghetto will be domicile and quiet, so they can forget about at least 2 million Palestinians in the overall demographic problem that they have. And of course people are not quiet and they do rebel, and they have connections to other people in the West Bank. So it's part of the struggle of the Palestinians against the Israelis or the Israeli colonisation of Palestine."

"One of the greatest Israeli successes for years was divide and rule. Fractioning or fragmenting the Palestinian existence into five different groups, and lately there was an attempt of the people on both sides - the West Bank and the Gaza Strip, to form a unity government once more which is against the Israeli interest and I think one of the immediate reasons for the Israeli onslaught that began with the arrest of the Hamas leadership in the West Bank is to try and fold this empty government.

I think the Israeli attempt is to weaken Hamas and to keep the Gaza Strip as a quiet prison rather than as a rebellious one."

'Like coming out of a maximum security prison': what it's like to cross into Gaza
Pics

I don't even 100% agree with Noams title cause of exactly the focus on the title that's happened but it isn't the worlds largest leap in logic to call it an open air prison

Frenzied Wombat · Jul 16, 2014

fanaskin_sl said:
no i'm saying what did they do to deserve that luxury resort that is gaza. if wombat committed a crime and was arrested it would be more meritorious of being in a prison, what did those people do to deserve the fruits of the luxury that is gaza.

ie wombat is implying all those people are worthy of prison like his fictional example and they should like their conditions cause you know, like they are all criminals.

No, I'm saying that calling it a prison ghetto where people are supposedly starving due to Israel blockading food is patently false, demonstrated by the fact that they're the 3rd fattest region/country in the world with photos/videos that certainly don't look anything like the "warsaw ghetto", which you've previously compared it to. You paint it as some ghetto slum with people starving in the streets, and that is obviously not the case outside of conflicts that they initiate, like now. It's certainly no luxury resort, but that video tour of Gaza is certainly anything but some starvation ridden slum. Fuck, there are many areas of Dallas that are worse of than that lol.

And I'm not implying Gazan civilians are worthy of prison. There are plenty of innocents in Gaza I'm sure, the question is when your civilians look just like the armed militia, and your militia lives, hide, and fires weapons from civilian homes and institutions, how do you separate the two? How do you put the bad guys in prison and free the innocents when you can't tell them apart? What do you do when you inherently believe that a 14 year old boy is "innocent", yet you're stopping 14 years old boys at your border crossing on a monthly basis that have suicide bomb vests?

Egypt is actually contributing to 1/2 of your "prison", why not go whine at them, particularly since they aren't even under attack. They aren't allowing shit across the border either, because just like Israel they don't fucking trust Hamas.

TheBeagle · Jul 16, 2014

Jesus you equivocate like a god damn seasoned politician.

Fana that is.

Narac01 · Jul 16, 2014

Frenzied Wombat_sl said:
On a humorous note, the Zionists are definitely winning at whose got the hottest female soldiers. I'd place the US second, though Sweden is looking pretty good too.

hot women of the IDF - The Patriot Files Forums

Don't all citizens (men and women) have to spend 2 years in IDF or is that another country I'm thinking of.

fanaskin · Jul 16, 2014

Frenzied Wombat_sl said:
No, I'm saying that calling it a prison ghetto where people are supposedly starving due to Israel blockading food is patently false, demonstrated by the fact that they're the 3rd fattest region/country in the world

citation needed

Frenzied Wombat_sl said:
Egypt is actually contributing to 1/2 of your "prison", why not go whine at them, particularly since they aren't even under attack. They aren't allowing shit across the border either, because just like Israel they don't fucking trust Hamas.

they don't control the air, ports, most of the road access, which gives them control over supplies even food like israel does at all, they also don't regularly invade them and bomb or strafe them either, have a recent history to take palestinian land and put "settlers" there either, they also didn't build a giant wall around gaza, they aren't "1/2" the control.

Frenzied Wombat · Jul 16, 2014

Narac01_sl said:
Don't all citizens (men and women) have to spend 2 years in IDF or is that another country I'm thinking of.

Yeah, unless you're an Orthodox Jew you need to spend two years in the Army, but that may change as the seculars aren't particularly happy about that exception. Israel has a lot of hot chicks because they don't get to do radar operator training and girly pushups during their two years, they supposedly have to meet most of the same standards the guys do. So two years of basic training puts them into pretty good physical shape. When I was there I saw a lot of Russian Caucasian Jew/Sephardic jew hybrids and those were insanely hot. The chicks are very verbally aggressive though-- like literally no filter on anything they say. They love Americans/Canadians, but don't piss them off. If you're an American GI over there, you get endless tail.

Frenzied Wombat · Jul 16, 2014

fanaskin_sl said:
citation needed

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/im...za-obesity.jpg

3rd in the world if you're a female Gazan, 8th in the world if you're a male Gazan. I guess hauling Qassam rockets around burns extra calories. Sucks to be a male Gazan I guess.

Gavinmad · Jul 16, 2014

I definitely question the accuracy of that 10 year old data, mainly because I refuse to believe that many countries have higher obesity rates than the USA.

fanaskin · Jul 16, 2014

this is the study that info blurb is based on which predates the "gaza diet strategy" btw and even then it shows that obesity is a reaction to eating increasingly cheaper quality foods and cheap calorie carbs especially amongst the lower metabolisms of the elderly driven by food insecurity, also that nutrition and access to better foods (meat and veg) was being restricted and households where having a much harder time getting regular food and turning towards junkier food. combined with the malnutrition information like among other malnutritions the increase in rickets (from quality of food deficiency), showing it was on the rise.

http://www.who.int/hac/crises/intern...n_June2005.pdf

starting on page 15,

1.3 Chronic diseases
Obesity
~
One reason commonly given for obesity is the increasingly poor 'quality' of the diet. The
suggestion is that adults are eating a greater quantity of cheaper starchy foods in place of
fresh vegetables and meat. There is some evidence to support this view (see below). Evidence
from a survey of refugee women in the West Bank found a strong association with parity

1.4 Impact of the current 'intifada' on nutrition

Impact on Food Security and Coping Strategies

Since the start of the 'intifada' in 2000, the Palestinian people have had to face increasing
poverty, unemployment and hardship.This has had a serious impact on household food
security with households finding it more and more difficult to access food.WFP report that
social safety nets and coping strategies employed by Palestinians are stretched to their limits
(World Food Programme 2004). One survey found that two thirds (63.8 per cent) of
households found difficulty in obtaining food during the 'intifada' (Palestinian Central
Bureau of Statistics et al. 2003).

Impact on Dietary Intake
There is some indication that dietary intake has deteriorated both in terms of quantity and
quality as a result of the 'intifada'.

Two surveys have collected data on the food intake of
young children through 24 hour recall (Al Quds University et al. 2004; Al Quds University
and Johns Hopkins University 2002). This type of data is notoriously difficult to collect

Nevertheless the surveys provide some indication of change over time.

The results suggest a
drop in intake of all nutrients between 2002 and 2003. See graph 7. A further survey in 2002
also found that more than half (64.7 per cent) of households reduced the quality of their food
during the 'intifada'

Frenzied Wombat · Jul 16, 2014

Twilight Sparkle_sl said:
I definitely question the accuracy of that 10 year old data, mainly because I refuse to believe that many countries have higher obesity rates than the USA.

It's hard to find current statistics that include Gaza/West Bank, but if you google "gaza obsesity" you'll find plenty of articles concerning the problem. I doubt they've undergone a radical national diet plan over the last ten years.

Their malnutrition is not coming from lack of food or starvation, but because just like a lot of other modern nations with obesity epidemics they eat shitty, unhealthy food, and fresh produce is more expensive. Most of the Arab world is both obese and technically "malnourished" as well, despite having plenty of food available on the shelves.

This Wikipedia article explains the phenomenon, and lists Palestine as #8 in the world in terms of obesity, but I can't fine the original reference listed in the footnote.

Obesity in the Middle East and North Africa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Palestinians are listed at the 8th place in world overweight population rankings.[17] This is due to decreased physical activityand greater than necessary food consumption,[18] particularly with an increase in energy coming from fat. Two other factors are smoking and urbanization. In addition, "leisure-time physical activity is not a common concept in the Palestinian context, especially for rural women, where lack of sex-segregated facilities and cultural norms are prohibitive factors." Women in urban areas face similar cultural restrictions.

Frenzied Wombat · Jul 16, 2014

fanaskin_sl said:
this is the study that info blurb is based on which predates the "gaza diet strategy" btw and even then it shows that obesity is a reaction to eating increasingly cheaper quality foods and cheap calorie carbs especially amongst the lower metabolisms of the elderly driven by food insecurity, also that nutrition and access to better foods (meat and veg) was being restricted and households where having a much harder time getting regular food and turning towards junkier food. combined with the malnutrition information like among other malnutritions the increase in rickets (from quality of food deficiency), showing it was on the rise.

starting on page 15,

Ahh, Ok now!! So you've moved on from "Israelis starving Palestinians" to "Palestinians eating junk food due to human misery and not being able to afford organic Kale". We're making progress! Please look at my link above from Wikipedia concerning the epidemic of obesity w/ simultaneous malnutrition in Arab countries, the phenomenon is not unique to Gaza-- it plagues the modern world in general wherever food is plentiful and poor people exist.

Your whole explanation could be carbon copied and applied to the USA lol. People turning to junk food due to unhappiness or inability to afford more expensive nutritious food.

fanaskin · Jul 16, 2014

no not at all, the study you alluded to was from ~1996-2004, the "gaza diet" strategy I linked a few times was enacted in ~2007-2010ish if you've been paying attention, but even back then it shows fundamentally how much israel controls the food[all] supply in gaza, I was showing you that the report you cite if you actually read it shows the food insecurity flows from israel's control of imports/exports to gaza and how that would cause obesity.

you typically responded with "these savages do it to themselves, they have plenty of food on the shelves but they eat junk", Which totally ignores the report you indirectly cited as evidence.

Frenzied Wombat_sl said:
Your whole explanation could be carbon copied and applied to the USA lol. People turning to junk food due to unhappiness or inability to afford more expensive nutritious food.

I guess but you can directly link gaza's economic fortunes to israel, but that's only part of it because it specifically states the SUPPLY and AVAILABILITY of those foods isn't there, it's not all a case of people turning to fast food cause they are lazy, they have an insecure food supply and if you look around why there's a handful of reasons directly linked to israel, one of them for example is israel's blockading of gaza's fishing industry.

Blockade of the Gaza Strip - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Fishing under fire off the Gaza coast

fanaskin · Jul 16, 2014

The Zionists are whining thread

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