True Detective

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Chukzombi

Millie's Staff Member
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I got the Twin Peaks vibe too, which is funny because I was just thinking the other day that if all these people shitting on this season had a thread for Twin Peaks back in the day, they would go even more fully retarded.

Not even Walking Dead gets this much shit, and that mess is ridiculous.
i think i said last week they are going for a david lynch theme and the problem is there is only one david lynch. when a show has to constantly "borrow" other people's ideas and styles its usually not a good sign of quality. there is a difference between paying homage and just flat out theft

I dunno. We hate on The Walking Dead pretty intensely.
they just finished their best season ever and its still a bad show. the acting is mostly terrible, the zombies are what saves it.
 
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popsicledeath

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i think i said last week they are going for a david lynch theme and the problem is there is only one david lynch. when a show has to constantly "borrow" other people's ideas and styles its usually not a good sign of quality. there is a difference between paying homage and just flat out theft


they just finished their best season ever and its still a bad show. the acting is mostly terrible, the zombies are what saves it.
Bah! Daryl is what saves TWD. He's so dreamy I got a picture of him at Ross. GF said we could hide it in the bedroom if I wanted. I said no, it's going in the living room!

But, yeah, TWD gets a ton of shit because it randomly does dumb shit they don't have to bother doing. All in all, it does what it aims to do pretty well. Just like David Lynch stuff is weird and sometimes cryptic, but always deliberate and I never just thought shit was there randomly or happened to be poorly thought out or unskillfully executed. Someone brought up Quinton Tarantino and the idea of thinly veiled satire, or re-hashing cheeseball genres in a better crafted, more entertaining way, which is cool because (at times) Tarantino executes his vision; you may not enjoy it, but you can say 'okay, I see exactly what he was trying to do and he accomplished it.'

Is season 2 of True Detective accomplishing what it aims to accomplish? Is it doing what it does very well? Is it succeeding in living up to it's vision?

I personally think no, not at all. And the fact people are just throwing excuses at it like 'it's supposed to be satire' or 'it's intentionally giving the finger to all the hipster fans' or that the dialog is intentionally 'bad' to create a certain mood (which are all arguments I've seen/heard people make) is kind of proof. Nobody really knows what they're trying to do, or why they're trying to do it. Sure, you may still enjoy it, but I don't think they have a concrete vision that we can see unfolding and trust they're executing.

Oh, meanwhile, speaking of borrowing ideas. I don't completely buy it and think it's a bit overblown, but people can google 'true detective plagiarism' if they have concerns. It's a fine line using another writers main themes, ideas or philosophies, especially when in a fiction work set in the 'real' world where in theory that character could have been influenced by that other writer, etc. But it's typically an accepted and supported practice when you're open about it. Some people doubt whether PizzaLotto was open about it, and claim he only cites Ligotti after being pushed into it are pretty valid. But, shrug, the biggest problem with being influenced by another writer is that it only becomes an issue or point of contention when you weren't good enough to reprocess it into something unique.

People do this all the time with Bukowski, here they think if you're drunk and rambling enough you'll get famous(ish) like Buk, when in reality Bukowski read a ton, was a student of his craft, and was very precise and deliberate in what he was doing and portraying, even when it was the image of a lazy, drunk, out of control hack. Trying to replicate that just makes amateur writers look like cheap ripoffs.

Is the real offense that the writer 'borrowing' from others is doing it, or that they aren't doing it well enough to stand on their own?
 
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popsicledeath

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I got the Twin Peaks vibe too, which is funny because I was just thinking the other day that if all these people shitting on this season had a thread for Twin Peaks back in the day, they would go even more fully retarded.

Not even Walking Dead gets this much shit, and that mess is ridiculous.
Hrm, getting Twin Peaks vibes? I guess you guys are just more astute, because I didn't get that at all. I mean, it's not there was anything like a 'Mulholland Dr.' sign to clue us in, so I dunno, Twin Peaks is a stretch imvho.

I agree, though. I mean, General Hospital is absurd! Why isn't it getting more shit than True Detective in the Soap Opera thread!
 

JVIRUS

Golden Knight of the Realm
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Conflicted gay cop from True Detective and Twin Peaks character James driving through the night on their bikes felt similar to me, as did the scenes of the singers at the bar in all 3 episodes thus far of S2.
 

spronk

FPS noob
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While I can see some comparisons to Lynch stuff like Twin Peaks, I don't think it compares very well. Lynch is all about showing normal every day people, contrasting that with the weird, bizarre, fringe extremes of society, and then slowly revealing how underneath the artifice the normal people are more like the exotic than they admit.

TD season 2 just straight up shows a bunch of broken, fringe people and doesn't really have any normal people at all. The mayors son for example is straight out of grand theft auto and totally ridiculous, which of course means he is the killer.

Anyways check out Ray Donovan, preview of episode 1 is around everywhere and its an excellent show. Speaking of missed casting choices, man I would have loved Ian McShane as the mob boss going straight instead of Vince Vaughn. Or goddamn imagine Jon Voight.
 

JVIRUS

Golden Knight of the Realm
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Hah ya man Twin Peaks these days could be a real tough pill to swallow for some, and it indeed has a damn long lull mid-ish end season 2, but overall I find it to be one of the most entertaining programs I have ever seen. Idiosyncrasies, oddly placed humor, and dated as it is I still love it
 

etchazz

Trakanon Raider
2,707
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While I can see some comparisons to Lynch stuff like Twin Peaks, I don't think it compares very well. Lynch is all about showing normal every day people, contrasting that with the weird, bizarre, fringe extremes of society, and then slowly revealing how underneath the artifice the normal people are more like the exotic than they admit.

TD season 2 just straight up shows a bunch of broken, fringe people and doesn't really have any normal people at all. The mayors son for example is straight out of grand theft auto and totally ridiculous, which of course means he is the killer.

Anyways check out Ray Donovan, preview of episode 1 is around everywhere and its an excellent show. Speaking of missed casting choices, man I would have loved Ian McShane as the mob boss going straight instead of Vince Vaughn. Or goddamn imagine Jon Voight.
I was hoping Vaughn would prove me wrong with this role, but no; he's just a really bad actor (unless it's a comedy).
 

Khane

Got something right about marriage
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Stayed away from this thread all day because I didn't watch ep 3 last night after a long ass weekend. Just finished it and now I'm disappointed. That was VV going "maniac" and he didn't sell it at all. He sucks in this role.

I still think the story is compelling enough to keep watching and Farrell really is a good actor and I like what McAdams is doing too. Mr. closet gay is starting to get interesting as well.
 

Agraza

Registered Hutt
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Sick of Ian McShane. Don't want to see him as the mob boss. He's almost the same character in everything.
 

Xevy

Log Wizard
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4,105
I think Velcoro saying "like cops use" was basically his hint to McAdams that Vinci is behind this and Velcoro already knows to a degree. The way he says it and looks at her is a huge tell. That's why he wanted off the case. He was sniffing around trying to do real, or TRUE, detective work on the case and some PD guy tried to shoo him off the case. It worked because he certainly asked to be removed from the case, but his superiors, after seeing him more submissive wanted him to stay on and steer McAdams to someone else "I like a pimp for this".

Kind of sucks that the case is more or less solved in my mind. We know which spider did it, now they just have to deconstruct the entire web. Very different than the Season 1 which was follow the organization to the individual. This will be find the individual to take down the organization. That's probably why they chose four main characters instead of two.
 

Chukzombi

Millie's Staff Member
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there is only 93 residents in vinci, it was never a mystery that the corrupt city government was involved in some manner, especially when the mayor has a mansion full of whores
 

Khane

Got something right about marriage
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14,002
I think Velcoro saying "like cops use" was basically his hint to McAdams that Vinci is behind this and Velcoro already knows to a degree. The way he says it and looks at her is a huge tell. That's why he wanted off the case. He was sniffing around trying to do real, or TRUE, detective work on the case and some PD guy tried to shoo him off the case. It worked because he certainly asked to be removed from the case, but his superiors, after seeing him more submissive wanted him to stay on and steer McAdams to someone else "I like a pimp for this".

Kind of sucks that the case is more or less solved in my mind. We know which spider did it, now they just have to deconstruct the entire web. Very different than the Season 1 which was follow the organization to the individual. This will be find the individual to take down the organization. That's probably why they chose four main characters instead of two.
You know who did it already? You know who killed Casper? You know who shot Velcoro with rubber buck shot?

Well goddamn Columbo why don't you enlighten us?
 

Xevy

Log Wizard
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4,105
I'm assuming it's the Mayor in conjunction with another entity. I don't have a name or anything. I think the mystery isn't who killed him as much as why. I'm betting he had some weird kinky sex thing with the Mayor's daughter or something and that's why he got iced. No 100% backing that, but something to that effect.
 

Agraza

Registered Hutt
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You got nothin. Sit down and watch the show bitch.
smile.png
 

Homsar

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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Blake is behind it, last 2 episodes vince has asked where the hell hes been or disapearing to
 

popsicledeath

Potato del Grande
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I think it's probably the mayor. He doesn't want Velcro to solve the case because it will lead back to the Mayor, and with state cops in tow. He won't let Velcro off the case, because Velcro is his inept insider keeping tabs on the state cops and hindering the investigation. So, when Velcro is actually solving shit and on the trail, he gets a warning, with magic bullets the Vinci police chief has access to of course. Can't kill him because that would just cause more investigation and suspicion, and the Mayor needs him as a buffer and/or fall-guy.

Mayor and Caspere were obviously in it together, and Caspere was a nut job, getting too flashy and big for his britches, so gets whacked. And the Mayor is in bed with W too, but doesn't seem particularly friendly with him and doesn't seem to trust him, so they aren't partners, so what does the Mayor care if W loses his money, especially since the Mayor probably has it. But when W was an idiot and bankrupt himself playing with the big boys, so has to try to figure out what happened to Caspere, the Mayor has to send him a message as well. Shoot his patsy with magic bullets, and kill his side kick.

Hopefully the Mayor's tragic son isn't involved, as that's a terrible red herring, but even worse if true.
 

popsicledeath

Potato del Grande
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Blake is behind it, last 2 episodes vince has asked where the hell hes been or disapearing to
Yeah. So painfully obvious it's probably true. My guess is he's the Mayor's inside man with W. That's why he always makes W repeat his overblown philosophical nonsense in layman terms to help him remember for his report to the Mayor.