Weight Loss Thread

Correct, free weights require your body to balance itself and utilize a lot more muscle than machines. Additionally machines sometimes have weird movement paths and restrictions that aren't ideal for most muscle groups.

As an engineer you'd think the most direct path of movement would be the most efficient, but in all actuality it is that removal of a direct path that promotes the most work on your body.

The reason that people post stuff like what Daelos did is because they are massive compound exercises that really build your entire body and are the most efficient workouts all around - and in fact that is very similar or even identical to Mark Rippetoe's Starting Strength routine.

Deathwing_sl said:

idk, I've had times where I was doing dumbbell curls and my strength gave out at the top of the curl. The dumbbell descended in the wrong direction and might have caused significant shoulder injury is someone wasn't there to catch it for me.

Why risk it if you can get a similar(less time efficient) workout on machines?

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If you're having that kind of problem with the dumbbell curl you should lower the weight. I've never seen nor heard of anyone injuring themselves doing dumbbell curls in the way you described, and I see old women doing dumbbell curls all the time. Hell, I'm having a hard time picturing what you just described, it sounds absolutely absurd.

I've only injured myself a few times while lifting and every single time it was because I tried to lift more weight than I could handle and using bad form.

You can do some things to failure, but I generally don't always do that. Usually I would do a particular exercise (let's say squats) and do something like 12 rep warm-up weights, 10 rep light weight, 8 rep little more weight, 4-6 reps on heavier weight (with a spotter if I was worried).

Sometimes on bicep I'll go to failure if I feel like they aren't getting a proper workout.

Deathwing_sl said:

Should you not push the reps until you can't do anymore? Thought the whole point was for your strength to essentially give out.

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You want to push your muscles hard, but you don't always have to literally go to failure. In the example you gave, you should have stopped before the final rep where your muscle gave out. When in doubt if you can complete another rep, don't try, or wait 30 seconds or so and then try to push it out. I never, ever go to absolute, literal failure unless I have a spotter. If people always went to absolute failure you'd have people getting crushed to death on bench presses and under squat bars all the time.

McCheese_sl said:

I know, and I still think the benefits are negligible for the vast majority of people. I've been doing fasted workouts for 2 years now; I wake up, drink a cup of black coffee, and hit the gym 5 days a week. In that time I've made huge gains in fat loss and muscle growth and strength. Is it possible my benefits might have been a bit better if I had been using BCAAs all this time? Sure, maybe, but I doubt it would be so dramatic that it would be noticeable.

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I have a very similar experience. When I did BFL i only gained strength and went up in weight and I never ate before lifting or HIIT. That program is designed that way and people make serious progress following it. I totally understand why it could be bad for a professional athletes but it's certainly not something applies to your avg gym goer.

Deathwing_sl said:

Sounds inefficient!

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Muscle failure isn't required to build muscle.

When you lift something heavy, even once, it forms small tears in the muscle. Your body repairs those tears and gets stronger in the process (think about it like breaking a bone where it forms more bone over the break site). This is also the reason I tell people that what you do in the gym is only about 10-20% of what matters. Diet and rest make up the bulk of your progress. If you don't provide your body the correct nutrition to repair the muscles, it won't happen, and if you don't get enough sleep, you're also fucking it up. There's a reason people (non-steroid users) don't go and do two a days 7 days a week. It's just not necessary.

The free weight versus machines thing has been covered pretty well already. The stabilizing systems around your muscles (tendons, ligaments, smaller muscles) get stressed more when you use free weights. For the compound lifts, this also includes things like your core (abdominals, rhomboids, lats, spinae erector) which basically a machine can't help you with. Sure, you can work those muscle individually onanothermachine, but that's incredibly ineffecient. Machines definitely have a place, and the longer I lift the more I use them, to be honest. But free weights (at the very least for compounds) are incredibly important for developing the "everything else" so that you're not imbalanced as much.

Finally, your concern about injuries is ridiculous. As long as you ensure you have good (doesn't have to be perfect/great) form and you're not ignoring signs from your body that you're doing something wrong, injuries aren't something you should be concerned with. It's when people start piling on more weight than they should (ego lifting) or ignore something like a shoulder impingement for months that you run into problems.

Elurin_sl said:

or ignore something like a shoulder impingement for months that you run into problems.

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Lol, YEAH Elurin. Listen to this guy.

Really, I don't understand how anyone can ever get 8 hours of sleep. There is just too much to do.

I actually haven't had a significant injury in a long time. And mine were due to me ignoring/pushing through minor pains and exacerbating them (chasing higher totals). Actually, most of my problems have been taken care of by doing stretching/mobility, foam rolling, and a lacrosse ball.

Just because I said that's why people get hurt doesn't mean I'm exempt from doing those things. But my goals are also very different from yours.

You shouldn't let concerns about injuries be what keeps you from using free weights. If you just don't want to do them, fine, but injuries from weight lifting aren't very common if you're not a jackass about it (once again, ego lifting).

Edit: I think the 8 hours of sleep probably comes from some stupid government shit we heard growing up, similar to the nutrition pyramid. I think generally 7 hours is considered sufficient for most people. But if you only need 6 hours and you wake up feeling rested, then you probably only need 6 hours. My statement was more like, don't stay up til 2am playing an MMO and get up at 6am for work and think your body is going to be able to build muscle.

taebin_sl said:

Lol, YEAH Elurin. Listen to this guy.

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I ignored mine for years figuring I was tough enough to work through the pain. Needed surgery, shoulder will never be the same. Ahh the young, stupid Khane.

chaos_sl said:

Really, I don't understand how anyone can ever get 8 hours of sleep. There is just too much to do.

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It's easy if you don't have kids. As a single guy I get easily 8 - 10 hours of sleep most nights, and that's with 2 jobs and going to the gym 5 days a week. That's also not counting my delightful weekend naps. However, I imagine kids fuck it all up.

Working to failure every time will quickly lead to overtraining. You're breaking your muscles down more than they can repair themselves which is why it's not recommended.

Ambiturner_sl said:

Working to failure every time will quickly lead to overtraining. You're breaking your muscles down more than they can repair themselves which is why it's not recommended.

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I would argue that this depends entirely on your split. I used to do a 7-day regime with 2 days on, 1 off, 2 on, 2 off and I would only hit each muscle group once per 7-days.

If someone is hitting the same muscle ground every 4 days then I'll buy that though.

chaos_sl said:

Meh, I like working out. It is relaxing and gives me a feeling of accomplishment when I do something.

I end up spending about 1.5 hours in the gym when I go. But that includes getting my kids in and settled in the child care, putting my shit up, weights, cardio, cooldown, and picking my kids up. I occasionally have to go change a dirty diaper mid-workout also because my kids are fucking HILARIOUS. I switch between legs/core and arms/chest/back days. I am sure I could split it up more and I probably will as time goes on, but this works for me right now.

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I like working out too and I encourage people to do it.

But a lot of people pretend like you need to do something special to lose weight. When you don't.

Sure, yeah, all you really need to do is just don't eat so fucking much. Or eat different things. But man, I love me some fucking cupcakes bros.