What vehicle do you drive?
- Thread starter Marmac
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Guest, did you like the last podcast notification?? Well here's the second one, and for the third podcast! Yep. This Thursday 8-8-24 at 7pm Central
Go here to check out his podcast thread for info on topics and links!Go into the FoH discord and find the Happy Time Fun Hour channel and give it a listen!
Siliconemelons
Avatar of War Slayer
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Volvo could never have met that goal...
"Plug-in hybrids are the worst of both worlds" - yeah... think of how this works people... lol... and I own one.
"Plug-in hybrids are the worst of both worlds" - yeah... think of how this works people... lol... and I own one.
Palum
what Suineg set it to
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The future is gas cars but with a 15K regulatory required EV motor and battery that's a completely separated powertrain but can be plugged into 120v to recharge and gets 15 miles. Once it dies you just turn it off in the screen.
Fucker
Log Wizard
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The goal isn't about green, it's about control. Smart chargers that governments can control. Drive too much? Use too much electricity? Use electricity during peak times? Let's tax that. California is going to require two-way chargers so they can use the battery in your car and electricity you paid for to help run the grid. Imagine having a fully charged car when you put it away at night, and waking up to one with a flat battery. They say they won't do that, but I guess they think all of us are gullible. The ultimate form of control? Turning off the charges so no one can charge their cars. Pretty hard to run a rebellion when 60% of the population can't check their mail without needing major knee surgery and stents...what will they do when the battery in their EV is flat?
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Kobayashi
Vyemm Raider
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I've been telling people this since they came out with all these targets. What good is producing these things if you don't have a buyer? There's only so many people that can afford the cost. That cost will continue to rise, too. Subsidies will dry up, registration costs are going skyrocket, insurance premiums are going to snowball.
I've always said that electric was going to turn into electrified which will then start having the definition degrade - we'll start with plug in hybrid, then regular hybrid, then eventually mild hybrid. Eventually, we'll be right back where we started with ICE vehicles, but with a tacked on 48V system powering some non-critical systems like HVAC.
I've always said that electric was going to turn into electrified which will then start having the definition degrade - we'll start with plug in hybrid, then regular hybrid, then eventually mild hybrid. Eventually, we'll be right back where we started with ICE vehicles, but with a tacked on 48V system powering some non-critical systems like HVAC.
Lambourne
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Hybrids of any kind are a stopgap solution and the worst of both worlds, all the cost and complexity of a modern combustion engine and the added weight of an electric motor and battery. They also wear their small batteries out much quicker than full EVs for the same usage pattern (easily 2-4x the number of charge/discharge cycles compared to full EV).
If you're not familiar, the way charge cycles wear out a battery is measured in 100%-0% cycles. If you use half the battery charge and then charge it up again, that counts as half a cycle for wear.
So take a 50 mile one way commute as an example, a PHEV with 35 miles of electric range might see two charge cycles per day (charge at home, charge at office) whereas an EV with 200 miles range would only use two 25% discharges or a single 50% discharge over the same commute. 4x the wear cycles for the hybrid.
I could see hydrogen or e-fuels (synthetic gasoline/diesel not made from oil) being used in those places where full EV is not practical but as battery prices come down (and charging infrastructure improves) I don't see much of a long term future for hybrids.
If you're not familiar, the way charge cycles wear out a battery is measured in 100%-0% cycles. If you use half the battery charge and then charge it up again, that counts as half a cycle for wear.
So take a 50 mile one way commute as an example, a PHEV with 35 miles of electric range might see two charge cycles per day (charge at home, charge at office) whereas an EV with 200 miles range would only use two 25% discharges or a single 50% discharge over the same commute. 4x the wear cycles for the hybrid.
I could see hydrogen or e-fuels (synthetic gasoline/diesel not made from oil) being used in those places where full EV is not practical but as battery prices come down (and charging infrastructure improves) I don't see much of a long term future for hybrids.
The_Black_Log Foler
PalsCo CEO - Stock Pals | Pantheon Pals
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New z4 looks awesome. I think if I ever could stomach the idea of owning a second car I don’t need I’d get one to go alongside my truck.
Palum
what Suineg set it to
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Aside from the hilarious fact that there Toyota Prius is a top seller, extremely reliable and well packaged for an economy car, you mean? Also aside from the fact that locomotives have been successfully using "hybrid" power for almost 100 years now?
It's certainly more complex, but the reality is if you want to mate the most efficient power delivery to the most efficient energy density, hydrocarbons powering electric motors is the best technology available.
Cad
scientia potentia est
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Palum
what Suineg set it to
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Well that's true also they seemed to have stop production for 2024, no idea. However their sales of hybrid vehicles in general are very high:
1.19M sales in 2024 first half (US), electrified is 450k. EV is only 15k of that.
Palum
what Suineg set it to
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Rav 4 hybrid has stolen all its sales i think in the USif you put the same 7500 tax credit on a prius that ev's get, they would sell out again
with no tax credit to skew buyer choice prius is high in japan
Cad
scientia potentia est
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Maybe, maybe not. The slow EV's like the Nissan Leaf never sold well here either. The prius is slow as balls, probably has something to do with it. Maybe they don't care if the cars have 90hp in Japan.if you put the same 7500 tax credit on a prius that ev's get, they would sell out again
with no tax credit to skew buyer choice prius is high in japan
Lanx
<Prior Amod>
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well, i mean the rav4 is just the best selling non truck
are ppl just getting the hybrid or plug in b/c thats the only rav4 left? heh
like, "yea we have 1 rav4 left, it's the rav 4 prime"
"fine i'll take it"
"oops it's already sold"
Palum
what Suineg set it to
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Well chicken/egg somewhat but out of curiosity Autotrader is listing 15,974 nationwide and hybrid is 7,363.
Siliconemelons
Avatar of War Slayer
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Toyota started doing that, where the hybrids were the only thing. as their roadmap - and they didn't have just gad versions - they did this with the Van, and I thought they did it with Rav4, but I looked online and they have a normal and hybrid still for that one.
Cad
scientia potentia est
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CaughtCross
Vyemm Raider
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I bought a Rav 4 plug in hybrid back in July and love it. I drove 2000 miles and used just over one tank of gas, have solar at home and am basically able to charge at home for free. With a full tank of gas and full battery get 600 mile range with it.