Wildstar Launch Thread - Server: Stormtalon | Faction: Dominion

Nevergone_sl said:

Nah, I'm just citing the change as one more thing Carbine is doing to intentionally make the game less fun.
The abysmal leveling experience is one glaring example. Attunement is another.

It's. just. not. fun.

And it therefore can fuck itself hard.

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The change allows for more loot to be obtained at the end of dungeons & adventures while simultaneously making it so if you don't gold the dungeon it isn't the end of the world and you'll still have access to the same loot table (with more drops than before). If you find that 'less fun' then I'm not sure how to answer you.

Jackdaddio_sl said:

So what I've experienced is wrong? Huh. When can I have my body back, Mr. Bodysnatcher?

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Since you asked I'll be happy to answer you:

TheYanger pointed out earlier that you were confusing adventures & dungeons. You were simply not smart enough to realize that the change in question affected dungeons more. As it stands the current change has provided about a 15% nerf to seeing the adventure purple you wanted while increasing the amount of blues (and thus a better chance at seeing good slotted blues by an exceptionally larger %). Since you have never experienced a gold medal dungeon it's easy for me to point out that your experience on something that you've never experienced is wrong. If you'd like to only discuss adventures you shouldn't try addressing them in your topic. Care to keep playing?

Nevergone_sl said:

Nah, I'm just citing the change as one more thing Carbine is doing to intentionally make the game less fun.
The abysmal leveling experience is one glaring example. Attunement is another.

It's. just. not. fun.

And it therefore can fuck itself hard.

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You've got it right. So do I. Because those areourexperiences. Voldeth is obviously having some other orgasmic thing altogether.

I like WildStar, I really do. Healing on an Esper is pretty fun. The housing shit I don't care for but usually don't in most games because it gets sappy after awhile. The PvP is meh to me. The crafting isn't FFXIV levels but it's decent and better than ESO's. Cooking sucks. The leveling was boring as hell and I'm tired of 'Strain' looking shit everywhere.

That said, the dungeons/Adventures other than Malgrave are fun and far more challenging than most MMOs and puts TESO to shame. I mean, I actually didn't mind queuing up with them. They pop really fast even when I did so as DPS (never more than 30 mins wait). The vast majority of runs I had early on were Silver but the last three weeks have been mostly Gold and I have a total of four purps, that's it. Even in PUGs because now there is at least one guy who knows how they work and most times the others will follow/listen.

Voldeth talking about 'WoW loot' cracks me up as if someone was actually comparing it to WoW loot. For me, the problems with the changes they made aren't even about the loot itself; it's about the SAME amount of time being put in as I did last week, coming to the SAME result (Gold) and getting The Price Is Right sound effects at the end. That's some stupid ass shit. Anyone defending this on THAT basis should be shot. It's dumb. Was this the only way they could have came up with a decent change to gear up casuals, of which, btw... I am one. Four purples and no completed Gold Dungeons says I am.

I'm not trying to speak for everyone or anyone really, I'm just saying what this change feels like to me as someone who wasn't overly geared but was happy with the rate the loot was dropping for completion. They made the change because it must be having adverse affects on their bottom line and I understand that, but from my personal point of view it stinks. If someone wants to grind the same things for less of a chance at the good stuff vs more of the mediocre stuff, more power to them. Seems like more of a waste of time to me know than how it was before when jokers quit after 10 minutes.

It seems like they are trying to change it to be more fun. Because the state of the LFG/LFD shit before was most definitely NOT fun. Not fun is sitting through 15-20 'Vote Disband' groups per night. That shit is not ok. Or finding a group only to zone in and the adventure has already begun and is disintegrating because they had a single death before you even got there. I don't expect the best shit in the game out of adventures and dungeons, just some sense of progression and the opportunity to play. If I get that, all good.

Voldeth_sl said:

Since you asked I'll be happy to answer you:

TheYanger pointed out earlier that you were confusing adventures & dungeons. You were simply not smart enough to realize that the change in question affected dungeonsmore. As it stands the current change has provided about a 15% nerf to seeing the adventure purple you wanted while increasing the amount of blues

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See that word you typed? It doesn't mean "only". It still affects Adventures however you want to phrase it.. 5% or 50. And Yanger assumed I was confused. I clarified in a follow up post I was not.

Please stop trying to explain to a moron like me how having a 15% nerf on purples for successfully fulfilling the highest difficulty in an Adventure (or anything) amounts to a good thing becausenowI'll have a whatever% at some Blue shit. I'll never understand that. I guess if I was trying to get blues (which I already have had for weeks because that shit even falls out of butt-level regular area mobs) then I'd be good with it.

But since anything Blue can be bought dirt cheap or found on a Dreg's ass, I find it difficult to understand the joy in your logic.

That is kind of silly, though. There are blues that drop in adventures that are better than the purples, the color alone doesn't dictate the item's desirability.

Jackdaddio_sl said:

See that word you typed? It doesn't mean "only". It still affects Adventures however you want to phrase it.. 5% or 50. And Yanger assumed I was confused. I clarified in a follow up post I was not.

Please stop trying to explain to a moron like me how having a 15% nerf on purples for successfully fulfilling the highest difficulty in an Adventure (or anything) amounts to a good thing becausenowI'll have a whatever% at some Blue shit. I'll never understand that. I guess if I was trying to get blues (which I already have had for weeks because that shit even falls out of butt-level regular area mobs) then I'd be good with it.

But since anything Blue can be bought dirt cheap or found on a Dreg's ass, I find it difficult to understand the joy in your logic.

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I'll try again since you've already acknowledged being slow. Log on your character and post a screenshot of your blue items. You'll notice that 90% of them will be 2-3 slotted items with horrible slots thus making them bad. A 4 slotted blue item with the right sockets is infinitely better than a 2 slotted purple item. THAT IS WHAT YOU"RE NOT UNDERSTANDING. You were busy laughing about the comparison with WoW because you're the exact type of idiot who doesn't understand how items work in this game.

Get it yet? You're not wrong because of your experience. You're wrong because you don't understand what it is your debating. You think that there are 4 slot blue items on the AH with fire/fire/logic/logic slots for sale that are 'dirt cheap'? Hint: No there isn't dumbshit.

chaos_sl said:

It seems like they are trying to change it to be more fun. Because the state of the LFG/LFD shit before was most definitely NOT fun. Not fun is sitting through 15-20 'Vote Disband' groups per night. That shit is not ok. Or finding a group only to zone in and the adventure has already begun and is disintegrating because they had a single death before you even got there. I don't expect the best shit in the game out of adventures and dungeons, just some sense of progression and the opportunity to play. If I get that, all good.

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PUGs will always be PUGs, no matter what loot table is put in. This game isn't set up for PUGs nor will ever be. Seems to me that's been done by design (Carbine seems to really push tight guild/group behavior ala FFXIV). I really can't imagine a 40 man PUG in this game and will never try that.

Not trying to be a smartass but I simply don't know why you just don't run with friends. I see all these people here in Rerolled asking about the guild and I suspect many are either in crappy small guilds or soloing around. Doesn't take long for a group with voice chat to run three straight Adventures (if they need that level of purple reward) or one good Dungeon.

I understand they want to bring the 'fun' in, but they are really doing it at the expense of the people they claim they want as a base... guilds and cohesive groups.

chaos_sl said:

That is kind of silly, though. There are blues that drop in adventures that are better than the purples, the color alone doesn't dictate the item's desirability.

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True. But you (and Voldeth) are assuming that you're now going to get four slot Blues as automatic or something. It doesn't really work that way either.

You still have just as much of a chance to get shit two slot Blues as shit two slot Purples. As a matter of fact, you have MORE of a chance to get them because you get.. more blues now. Four and Five slot Blues aren't really common as drops.

Voldeth_sl said:

I'll try again since you've already acknowledged being slow. Log on your character and post a screenshot of your blue items. You'll notice that 90% of them will be 2-3 slotted items with horrible slots thus making them bad. A 4 slotted blue item with the right sockets is infinitely better than a 2 slotted purple item. THAT IS WHAT YOU"RE NOT UNDERSTANDING. You were busy laughing about the comparison with WoW because you're the exact type of idiot who doesn't understand how items work in this game.

Get it yet? You're not wrong because of your experience. You're wrong because you don't understand what it is your debating. You think that there are 4 slot blue items on the AH with fire/fire/logic/logic slots for sale that are 'dirt cheap'? Hint: No there isn't dumbshit.

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You really hate WoW that much to keep bringing it up? I don't even know what to say to that. The odds of getting a four slotted Blue are really good, huh? No. You could/can end up with just as much shitty two and three slot Blue as shitty two and three shot Purple. I still don't understand you saying a 15% nerf to a chance at getting a 4 slot Purple is great.

Again, that's the slow part of my brain so I guess I'm done with ya. Better than going round and round.

Jackdaddio_sl said:

You really hate WoW that much to keep bringing it up? I don't even know what to say to that. The odds of getting a four slotted Blue are really good, huh? No. You could/can end up with just as much shitty two and three slot Blue as shitty two and three shot Purple. I still don't understand you saying a 15% nerf to a chance at getting a 4 slot Purple is great.

Again, that's the slow part of my brain so I guess I'm done with ya. Better than going round and round.

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No. The odds of getting a 4 slot blue item (which would be an exceptional upgrade for someonejust like youwas nearly tripled even IF you didn't complete Gold.

If you want me to explain to you the changes to purples in regards to adventures, here's some copy & paste formula for your brain:

Crimelords
32 blue, 8 purple

Based on your pattern with 40 rolls you would have a 100% chance to get your item. With randomness you can statistically never have 100% chance so it has to be logarithmic. The correct formula is:

1-(39/40)^n or 1-[(1-(1/40))^n]

Where n=the number of rolls at a loot table of 40 pieces and you're trying for one piece. If n=3 (3 rolls for gold) it's 7.3% not 7.5%.

there is supposed to be an added roll against a loot table with epics and whatever blues were in the previous silver table. If 20 pieces total (my guess based on differences between wildstarloot.com and jabbithole.com), it's 5% chance. A now more complicated formula considering both loot tables is:

1 - [1-(1/20)] * [1-(1/40)]^3 = 11.9%

And again this is based on getting a single item, which is what most people would consider running an adventure again for. If you can actually use 2 items, the numbers change again not in favor of the "new" system.

This is in reference to getting your desired purple item in an adventure. You roughly have the same chance as before of seeing YOUR DESIRED ITEM - the change can only be considered a nerf if you're looking for multiple purples from the same adventure. Added to this (as mentioned before) you're getting significantly more loot that has the potential to be better than the purples you would have gone for before.

I know that was a lot to take in. Try to read slowly.

Jackdaddio_sl said:

PUGs will always be PUGs, no matter what loot table is put in. This game isn't set up for PUGs nor will ever be. Seems to me that's been done by design (Carbine seems to really push tight guild/group behavior ala FFXIV). I really can't imagine a 40 man PUG in this game and will never try that.

Not trying to be a smartass but I simply don't know why you just don't run with friends. I see all these people here in Rerolled asking about the guild and I suspect many are either in crappy small guilds or soloing around. Doesn't take long for a group with voice chat to run three straight Adventures (if they need that level of purple reward) or one good Dungeon.

I understand they want to bring the 'fun' in, but they are really doing it at the expense of the people they claim they want as a base... guilds and cohesive groups.
True. But you (and Voldeth) are assuming that you're now going to get four slot Blues as automatic or something. It doesn't really work that way either.

You still have just as much of a chance to get shit two slot Blues as shit two slot Purples. As a matter of fact, you have MORE of a chance to get them because you get.. more blues now. Four and Five slot Blues aren't really common as drops.

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I am in the RR guild, which is actually a raiding guild. These guys are golding Swordmaiden while I am trying to gear up via adventures and I have limited playtime so 9 times out of 10 PUG is what is in store for me. Running with friends is simply not always an option. I mean, we're not talking about 40 man PUGs, we're talking about dungeons here. And people can do the dungeons, they are difficult but they aren't THAT hard. The 'gold or bust' mentality was extremely detrimental to gameplay. Even people who wanted to disband on a single death or missed objective, it isn't as if they enjoy that shit. No one wants to waste their time. But newer players have to learn these dungeons and be afforded the opportunity to progress, or else I can't imagine how the game hopes to survive.

Voldeth_sl said:

Guesstamation math posted here

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lol this guy...

Okay, you're right. I totally don't understand any of this and I and read it super slow as directed.. probably I am just looking to quit and continue playing FFXIV. It's just my own perception that I was getting more decent purples than fantastic four slot Blues when finishing Gold runs before and the Blues that dropped I don't remember seeing a crapload of 4 slot Blues. I guess your runs got them all.

Anyroad, I think WildStar is a decent game but I'll probably just use this as a good reason to not re-sub to it and wait for the inevitable conversion. That way, when I get reduced chance (15% nerf by your posting) for the same maximum effort I won't feel so bad since I won't be paying then.

Not checking your math because I'm sure based on the amount of speculative conjecture and guesses you made based on someone else's speculative conjecture and guesses (you cite Jabbithole etc), that it's right.

Jackdaddio_sl said:

lol this guy...

(you cite Jabbithole etc), that it's right.

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The citation is in reference to loot drops in order to determine how many items may drop from the adventure. Unless you believe that adventure loot hasn't been fully discovered, it isn't exactly speculation but keep trying?

TJT_sl said:

Giving me a math hardon here Voldeth, bravo Ser.

Also chaos, as someone who also has limited playtime I am more than willing to run some with you. I'm playing stalker tank. Also got removed from guild again for not being able to log in enough I presume! But I won't press it.

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Nah, we still have a casual rank available for anyone interested. There was a slight error that may or may not have been my fault (details of this are still being investigated) which resulted in the guild being blown up. Feel free to contact anyone for an invite and they'll be happy to do it (just specify that you're from RR and playing casually so that we can set you on the right rank).

Ao-_sl said:

You guys have anyone rolling alts or leveling slowly? I made it to 50 on an engi on Exiles and then went on vacation, but I want to switch sides and see what's going on with the guild and the dominion storyline. I'll try to casually raid/support the group.

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To be honest, not really. We have ~25 raiders and ~25 more casual players. Most of them are all 50. The guild is a good place to be if you're 50 and want to run adventures/dungeons but we don't have many still leveling up. Which isn't to say that anyone leveling up isn't welcome (you certainly are!) just that it might be a little lonely until you hit 50.

TJT_sl said:

Giving me a math hardon here Voldeth, bravo Ser.

Also chaos, as someone who also has limited playtime I am more than willing to run some with you. I'm playing stalker tank. Also got removed from guild again for not being able to log in enough I presume! But I won't press it.

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Yeah add me, I'm Soaked in game. I should be on some this weekend.

Running Tempest Refuge last night I have to say it was disappointing to gold it and not get the shinies, but we cheated like everyone else does anyway so whatever. I don't think there are even any upgrades for me there, I was just doing it for attunement.