EQ Never

They said your available classes will be determined by your current faction standing with any particular class. So if you started off as a paladin you won't be able to mix your Paladin with a rogue or sk,necro etc. To be a paladin you would of have to of done good things for npc quests choices. To be a rogue you would of had to do sinister stuff and to be evil well you get the idea. Your fotm class choice will be determined by what you do everyday in the game. Go kill guards to your starting city and you won't be able to stay as a paladin and vise versa.

qwerty_sl said:

Someone mentioned MTG? 0.o

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It's more like Pokemon. Except instead of evolving, you go up in tiers and can choose which abilities to augment with new armor. So, Leage/Pokemon is a far more apt description.

If you see someone rocking MagiBane Tier 4, you can flip your paper doll open and say "Assasin, I choose you!" And your tier 4 counter to Magibane will load up and you have your little duel. Essentially the most powerful people will be the ones with the most fully evolved Pokemons, because they will have a counter to many specifc problems.

Is that a Fire Elemental? Water Mage, I choose you!

Oh no, is that a wind elemental Tier 4? My Earth Mage is only Tier 2, I'm not sure if he's strong enough! So I'll go with Fire Mage! Even though it's not a direct counter, it's Tier 4----> I expect most difficult strategy choices in game to look like this. Essentially coming down to counters and choices based on collection.

Blackwulf_sl said:

Uh, I don't wanna quibble with you, Teekay, but that quote is from his own bio. We all talk ourselves up in our bios and resumes. Third party sites regarding Project Offset that I read don't even mention him. For instance:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Offset_Software(granted his part may have been huge, and I just can't find anything saying so)

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Because he wasn't apart of the group that created the game engine in their garage (Offset Software). You're probably right to some extent, though.

tad10_sl said:

No. Multiple occasions they mentioned there would likely be a SK/Paladin exclusion. But they did make it clear there would be very few exclusions like that. They should have a Necro/Paladin and Necro/Cleric exclusion too (if Cleric is even in the game).

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but i remember hearing them say even though you were a dick head and can't become a paladin, you could redeem yourself (increase faction with pally's) and become a paladin or become a shitbag (increase shadow knight faction) to become a shadow knight. So you could at some point become both. If they have said otherwise this is just more concrete evidence that they are so unsure of how this game will be and the state of the game is different in each of their heads.

Terial_sl said:

While i agree that the difficulty to change between classes will be paramount to the whole thing, why does nobody seem to give a crap that Elder Scrolls Online is already doing this and everyone is okay with it, but here, everyone hates it. (don't get me wrong, i hate it too, class/role definition is extremely important)
But in ESO you can be a caster, switch to a sword and shield without skipping a beat and then keep on attacking, then switch to a bow and kill a few in the distance, then back to casting.. all while not even changing armor.
If this is okay in ESO, why is it so bad in EQN?

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Because no one cares about ESO?

heh, and I'm kind of okay with a Pokemon-Class game, as long as it's designed well. I wish they would have made it more pet based, but I'm willing to see if they can make constantly shifting identities work.

Draegan_sl said:

It depends on how you make the game. Switching between classes is going to be easy. However, they have said that they want you to collect classes, so that might be the difficult part. They also want you to level up those classes to get more advanced skills (something that GW2 really needed to do). You also need gear to make those classes shine.

So in the end, what you may end up with, is everyone has the cleric class or whatever, but without the combination of class X, Y with gear item A, B they could only heal noob dungeons anyway so who cares?

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Key thing people are missing - which you sorta point out is->

There are huge energy and game limitation on setting up your skills. You can't just slot any skill on any class.

1. We've got the you can only slot skill related to class abilities (Rogue base can only slot 1 U, 1M, 2O)
2. Skills cost energy or mana (energy and mana may be same thing fwiw - wasn't clear) or endurance. So if you're trying to make a teleport + backstab combo, you will find that if you don't have the right items (say a ring of -5% movement cost) you won't be able to execute your teleport + backstab combo.
3. The ability spamming going on in the demo was "not the norm".

Convo_sl said:

They are taking serious heat on this trinity thing. Probably would of been better off making EQ3 and releasing this under a new IP. Even if they do have a better system all this fuss is going to raise serious doubts for them.

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I think it was how vehement he was with it...If your game is really open, and you have healers, a trinity will probably arise naturally. It might not be the ONLY method, your game might support kiting, walling and various other strategies that bypass the trinity. But saying "NO HEALERS WARBAGABLE!" made it seem like their only plan to end the trinity was to not allow healing classes, which is really dumb.

That and, as said earlier, it sound more personal and less rational than it should have. Some guy had his cleric GF cheat on him and leave with the main tank, and now he hates healers, is what it feels like.

slicedmass_sl said:

but i remember hearing them say even though you were a dick head and can't become a paladin, you could redeem yourself (increase faction with pally's) and become a paladin or become a shitbag (increase shadow knight faction) to become a shadow knight. So you could at some point become both. If they have said otherwise this is just more concrete evidence that they are so unsure of how this game will be and the state of the game is different in each of their heads.

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Yes, they said you could do the Anakin Skywalker thing, but you wouldn't be able to use their ability simultaneously or if it was more drastic and you would actually lose the other class (that's what they don't know - the mechanics). But you will not be running both SK/Paladin set of abilities simulataneously - you will not be able to slot life drain (sk skill) and holy touch (Pally skill) at the same time, even if you have room on your ability bar. This was from Avair - the lead class dev.

Convo_sl said:

They are taking serious heat on this trinity thing. Probably would of been better off making EQ3 and releasing this under a new IP. Even if they do have a better system all this fuss is going to raise serious doubts for them.

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There's not a player I know that enjoyed GW2's garbage dungeon setup. If someone is going to make dungeons hard/fun while still making them not based around the trinity it's probably not going to be SOE. It's not fun to kite around every trash pack/boss, it's boring and stupid.

Have they said anything about support classes? Like enchanters/CC? Or are we still Tank/Heal/DPS based? with 40+ skills/souls, there is room for utility

tad10_sl said:

Key thing people are missing - which you sorta point out is->

There are huge energy and game limitation on setting up your skills. You can't just slot any skill on any class.

1. We've got the you can only slot skill related to class abilities (Rogue base can only slot 1 U, 1M, 2O)
2. Sills cost energy. So if you're trying to make a teleport + backstab combo, you will find that if you don't have the right items (say a ring of -5% movement cost) you won't be able to execute your teleport + backstab combo.
3. The ability spamming going on in the demo was "not the norm".

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Yeah, so breeding a unique Pokemon...I mean, creating a working class, requires you go find gear and tune it. Again, it comes down to the people with more classes, that are tiered up with function items, are going to have more counters to specific problems-- just like counter picking in League or Pokemon. So the difficulty of the game most likely is not ONLY going to come from the discreet encounters themselves, but going out into the world and having the tools that work best against discreet encounters. Like a counter pick in League.

TecKnoe_sl said:

i just really dont understand how that did not take off... i mean right now id take that over anything out/coming up in the next 4 years.

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It didn't take off, because they sold out to Intel for $$$. And all Intel wanted was the engine, a software component to their hardware endeavors at the time- Larrabee, which failed spectacularly by the way. So they trashed the game, and shelved the engine.

The only game which licensed and is using the engine before the debacle was Red 5's Firefall.

The selling-out came with a fair bit of controversy too, because the producers had solicited the community for quite a bit of money to help it get made, with the promise of the game, yet of course received none of the profits from the sale to Intel.

Draegan_sl said:

where there is no questing

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There is a lot of questing it is just not "?" questing. There is a ton of authored content (this is also from people sitting at the Butler table) StoryBricks is not just about dynamic quests, but also about dynamic changes to authored content. This is the "get the relic from the bottom of the mine" example in one of the panels - where the ownership of the mine will change according to how the 3 groups interested in the mine react via storybricks. So the mechanics of achieving the quest change depending on who is in control of the mine when you get the "get the relic" quest.

Terial_sl said:

While i agree that the difficulty to change between classes will be paramount to the whole thing, why does nobody seem to give a crap that Elder Scrolls Online is already doing this and everyone is okay with it, but here, everyone hates it. (don't get me wrong, i hate it too, class/role definition is extremely important)
But in ESO you can be a caster, switch to a sword and shield without skipping a beat and then keep on attacking, then switch to a bow and kill a few in the distance, then back to casting.. all while not even changing armor.
If this is okay in ESO, why is it so bad in EQN?

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Unfortunately for me I've had most of my mmo hopes dashed in the past few months be it reveals . stress tests , or gameplay videos , ESO being one of them.

Honestly ESO and Wildstar I really have zero interest in now , EQN is only going to be something I want to play if they have some sort of special ruleset hardcore PVE/PVP servers , and somehow ArcheAge now actually looms as the closest thing to a fantasy mmo I may at least play a few months of.

Big Flex_sl said:

https://twitter.com/DaveGeorgeson/st...15992991985665

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Marketing will decide what our twitter responses should be

Lithose_sl said:

Yeah, so breeding a unique Pokemon...I mean, creating a working class, requires you go find gear and tune it. Again, it comes down to the people with more classes, that are tiered up with function items, are going to have more counters to specific problems-- just like counter picking in League or Pokemon. So the difficulty of the game most likely is not ONLY going to come from the discreet encounters themselves, but going out into the world and having the tools that work best against discreet encounters. Like a counter pick in League.

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But remember the alternative. People focusing on a few classes will have an easier time itemzing for those classes and should "advance" faster.

Braen_sl said:

Have they said anything about support classes? Like enchanters/CC? Or are we still Tank/Heal/DPS based? with 40+ skills/souls, there is room for utility

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Theres no trinity so no we arent tank heals dps based. There may still be ccing and what not (there almost certainly is) but not lock down tons of mobs indefinitley cc.

I think this reveal would've went over a lot better if it didn't have the EverQuest name attached to it.

Nothing I saw at any of the panels made me think "Oh yeah, that's EverQuest right there". I'm not even asking for EQ:HD or anything. But the races don't look like EQ races, the art style was wrong, the locations seemed generic (not that we've seen much beyond concept art), the gameplay is very different...I mean, there's time to turn it all around, since again, the "reveal" was mainly revealing how they don't have anything in-game yet really (other than a couple of models and animations along with Voxel Farm working with Lightforge). But I don't have any hope that it will.

This will still probably be fun for a month or two. But an EverQuest game? Unlikely.